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Open Source Android App - MtGox Live Bitcoin Trader

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[Android / iOS / Open Source] MtGox Live Bitcoin Trader 1.5 includes MtGox Live charts!

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An extensive guide for cashing out bitcoin and cryptocurrencies into private banks

Hey guys.
Merry Xmas !
I am coming back to you with a follow up post, as I have helped many people cash out this year and I have streamlined the process. After my original post, I received many requests to be more specific and provide more details. I thought that after the amazing rally we have been attending over the last few months, and the volatility of the last few days, it would be interesting to revisit more extensively.
The attitude of banks around crypto is changing slowly, but it is still a tough stance. For the first partial cash out I operated around a year ago for a client, it took me months to find a bank. They wouldn’t want to even consider the case and we had to knock at each and every door. Despite all my contacts it was very difficult back in the days. This has changed now, and banks have started to open their doors, but there is a process, a set of best practices and codes one has to follow.
I often get requests from crypto guys who are very privacy-oriented, and it takes me months to have them understand that I am bound by Swiss law on banking secrecy, and I am their ally in this onboarding process. It’s funny how I have to convince people that banks are legit, while on the other side, banks ask me to show that crypto millionaires are legit. I have a solid background in both banking and in crypto so I manage to make the bridge, but yeah sometimes it is tough to reconcile the two worlds. I am a crypto enthusiast myself and I can say that after years of work in the banking industry I have grown disillusioned towards banks as well, like many of you. Still an account in a Private bank is convenient and powerful. So let’s get started.
There are two different aspects to your onboarding in a Swiss Private bank, compliance-wise.
*The origin of your crypto wealth
*Your background (residence, citizenship and probity)
These two aspects must be documented in-depth.
How to document your crypto wealth. Each new crypto millionaire has a different story. I may detail a few fun stories later in this post, but at the end of the day, most of crypto rich I have met can be categorized within the following profiles: the miner, the early adopter, the trader, the corporate entity, the black market, the libertarian/OTC buyer. The real question is how you prove your wealth is legit.
1. Context around the original amount/investment Generally speaking, your first crypto purchase may not be documented. But the context around this acquisition can be. I have had many cases where the original amount was bought through Mtgox, and no proof of purchase could be provided, nor could be documented any Mtgox claim. That’s perfectly fine. At some point Mtgox amounted 70% of the bitcoin transactions globally, and people who bought there and managed to withdraw and keep hold of their bitcoins do not have any Mtgox claim. This is absolutely fine. However, if you can show me the record of a wire from your bank to Tisbane (Mtgox's parent company) it's a great way to start.
Otherwise, what I am trying to document here is the following: I need context. If you made your first purchase by saving from summer jobs, show me a payroll. Even if it was USD 2k. If you acquired your first bitcoins from mining, show me the bills of your mining equipment from 2012 or if it was through a pool mine, give me your slushpool account ref for instance. If you were given bitcoin against a service you charged, show me an invoice.
2. Tracking your wealth until today and making sense of it. What I have been doing over the last few months was basically educating compliance officers. Thanks God, the blockchain is a global digital ledger! I have been telling my auditors and compliance officers they have the best tool at their disposal to lead a proper investigation. Whether you like it or not, your wealth can be tracked, from address to address. You may have thought all along this was a bad feature, but I am telling you, if you want to cash out, in the context of Private Banking onboarding, tracking your wealth through the block explorer is a boon. We can see the inflows, outflows. We can see the age behind an address. An early adopter who bought 1000 BTC in 2010, and let his bitcoin behind one address and held thus far is legit, whether or not he has a proof of purchase to show. That’s just common sense. My job is to explain that to the banks in a language they understand.
Let’s have a look at a few examples and how to document the few profiles I mentioned earlier.
The trader. I love traders. These are easy cases. I have a ton of respect for them. Being a trader myself in investment banks for a decade earlier in my career has taught me that controlling one’s emotions and having the discipline to impose oneself some proper risk management system is really really hard. Further, being able to avoid the exchange bankruptcy and hacks throughout crypto history is outstanding. It shows real survival instinct, or just plain blissed ignorance. In any cases traders at exchange are easy cases to corroborate since their whole track record is potentially available. Some traders I have met have automated their trading and have shown me more than 500k trades done over the span of 4 years. Obviously in this kind of scenario I don’t show everything to the bank to avoid information overload, and prefer to do some snacking here and there. My strategy is to show the early trades, the most profitable ones, explain the trading strategy and (partially expose) the situation as of now with id pages of the exchanges and current balance. Many traders have become insensitive to the risk of parking their crypto at exchange as they want to be able to trade or to grasp an occasion any minute, so they generally do not secure a substantial portion on the blockchain which tends to make me very nervous.
The early adopter. Provided that he has not mixed his coin, the early adopter or “hodler” is not a difficult case either. Who cares how you bought your first 10k btc if you bought them below 3$ ? Even if you do not have a purchase proof, I would generally manage to find ways. We just have to corroborate the original 30’000 USD investment in this case. I mainly focus on three things here:
*proof of early adoption I have managed to educate some banks on a few evidences specifically related to crypto markets. For instance with me, an old bitcointalk account can serve as a proof of early adoption. Even an old reddit post from a few years ago where you say how much you despise this Ripple premined scam can prove to be a treasure readily available to show you were early.
*story telling Compliance officers like to know when, why and how. They are human being looking for simple answers to simple questions and they don’t want like to be played fool. Telling the truth, even without a proof can do wonders, and even though bluffing might still work because banks don’t fully understand bitcoin yet, it is a risky strategy that is less and less likely to pay off as they are getting more sophisticated by the day.
*micro transaction from an old address you control This is the killer feature. Send a $20 worth transaction from an old address to my company wallet and to one of my partner bank’s wallet and you are all set ! This is gold and considered a very solid piece of evidence. You can also do a microtransaction to your own wallet, but banks generally prefer transfer to their own wallet. Patience with them please. they are still learning.
*signature message Why do a micro transaction when you can sign a message and avoid potentially tainting your coins ?
*ICO millionaire Some clients made their wealth participating in ETH crowdsale or IOTA ICO. They were very easy to deal with obviously and the account opening was very smooth since we could evidence the GENESIS TxHash flow.
The miner Not so easy to proof the wealth is legit in that case. Most early miners never took screenshot of the blocks on bitcoin core, nor did they note down the block number of each block they mined. Until the the Slashdot article from August 2010 anyone could mine on his laptop, let his computer run overnight and wake up to a freshly minted block containing 50 bitcoins back in the days. Not many people were structured enough to store and secure these coins, avoid malwares while syncing the blockchain continuously, let alone document the mined blocks in the process. What was 50 BTC worth really for the early miners ? dust of dollars, games and magic cards… Even miners post 2010 are generally difficult to deal with in terms of compliance onboarding. Many pool mining are long dead. Deepbit is down for instance and the founders are MIA. So my strategy to proof mining activity is as follow:
*Focusing on IT background whenever possible. An IT background does help a lot to bring some substance to the fact you had the technical ability to operate a mining rig.
*Showing mining equipment receipts. If you mined on your own you must have bought the hardware to do so. For instance mining equipment receipts from butterfly lab from 2012-2013 could help document your case. Similarly, high electricity bill from your household on a consistent basis back in the day could help. I have already unlocked a tricky case in the past with such documents when the bank was doubtful.
*Wallet.dat files with block mining transactions from 2011 thereafter This obviously is a fantastic piece of evidence for both you and me if you have an old wallet and if you control an address that received original mined blocks, (even if the wallet is now empty). I will make sure compliance officers understand what it means, and as for the early adopter, you can prove your control over these wallet through a microtransaction. With these kind of addresses, I can show on the block explorer the mined block rewards hitting at regular time interval, and I can even spot when difficulty level increased or when halvening process happened.
*Poolmining account. Here again I have educated my partner bank to understand that a slush account opened in 2013 or an OnionTip presence was enough to corroborate mining activity. The block explorer then helps me to do the bridge with your current wallet.
*Describing your set up and putting it in context In the history of mining we had CPU, GPU, FPG and ASICs mining. I will describe your technical set up and explain why and how your set up was competitive at that time.
The corporate entity Remember 2012 when we were all convinced bitcoin would take over the world, and soon everyone would pay his coffee in bitcoin? How naïve we were to think transaction fees would remain low forever. I don’t blame bitcoin cash supporters; I once shared this dream as well. Remember when we thought global adoption was right around the corner and some brick and mortar would soon accept bitcoin transaction as a common mean of payment? Well, some shop actually did accept payment and held. I had a few cases as such of shops holders, who made it to the multi million mark holding and had invoices or receipts to proof the transactions. If you are organized enough to keep a record for these trades and are willing to cooperate for the documentation, you are making your life easy. The digital advertising business is also a big market for the bitcoin industry, and affiliates partner compensated in btc are common. It is good to show an invoice, it is better to show a contract. If you do not have a contract (which is common since all advertising deals are about ticking a check box on the website to accept terms and conditions), there are ways around that. If you are in that case, pm me.
The black market Sorry guys, I can’t do much for you officially. Not that I am judging you. I am a libertarian myself. It’s just already very difficult to onboard legit btc adopters, so the black market is a market I cannot afford to consider. My company is regulated so KYC and compliance are key for me if I want to stay in business. Behind each case I push forward I am risking the credibility and reputation I have built over the years. So I am sorry guys I am not risking it to make an extra buck. Your best hope is that crypto will eventually take over the world and you won’t need to cash out anyway. Or go find a Lithuanian bank that is light on compliance and cooperative.
The OTC buyer and the libertarian. Generally a very difficult case. If you bought your stack during your journey in Japan 5 years ago to a guy you never met again; or if you accumulated on https://localbitcoins.com/ and kept no record or lost your account, it is going to be difficult. Not impossible but difficult. We will try to build a case with everything else we have, and I may be able to onboard you. However I am risking a lot here so I need to be 100% confident you are legit, before I defend you. Come & see me in Geneva, and we will talk. I will run forensic services like elliptic, chainalysis, or scorechain on an extract of your wallet. If this scan does not raise too many red flags, then maybe we can work together ! If you mixed your coins all along your crypto history, and shredded your seeds because you were paranoid, or if you made your wealth mining professionally monero over the last 3 years but never opened an account at an exchange. ¯_(ツ)_/¯ I am not a magician and don’t get me wrong, I love monero, it’s not the point.
Cashing out ICOs Private companies or foundations who have ran an ICO generally have a very hard time opening a bank account. The few banks that accept such projects would generally look at 4 criteria:
*Seriousness of the project Extensive study of the whitepaper to limit the reputation risk
*AML of the onboarding process ICOs 1.0 have no chance basically if a background check of the investors has not been conducted
*Structure of the moral entity List of signatories, certificate of incumbency, work contract, premises...
*Fiscal conformity Did the company informed the authorities and seek a fiscal ruling.
For the record, I am not into the tax avoidance business, so people come to me with a set up and I see if I can make it work within the legal framework imposed to me.
First, stop thinking Switzerland is a “offshore heaven” Swiss banks have made deals with many governments for the exchange of fiscal information. If you are a French citizen, resident in France and want to open an account in a Private Bank in Switzerland to cash out your bitcoins, you will get slaughtered (>60%). There are ways around that, and I could refer you to good tax specialists for fiscal optimization, but I cannot organize it myself. It would be illegal for me. Swiss private banks makes it easy for you to keep a good your relation with your retail bank and continue paying your bills without headaches. They are integrated to SEPA, provide ebanking and credit cards.
For information, these are the kind of set up some of my clients came up with. It’s all legal; obviously I do not onboard clients that are not tax compliant. Further disclaimer: I did not contribute myself to these set up. Do not ask me to organize it for you. I won’t.
EU tricks
Swiss lump sum taxation Foreign nationals resident in Switzerland can be taxed on a lump-sum basis if they are not gainfully employed in our country. Under the lump-sum tax regime, foreign nationals taking residence in Switzerland may choose to pay an expense-based tax instead of ordinary income and wealth tax. Attractive cantons for the lump sum taxation are Zug, Vaud, Valais, Grisons, Lucerne and Berne. To make it short, you will be paying somewhere between 200 and 400k a year and all expenses will be deductible.
Switzerland has adopted a very friendly attitude towards crypto currency in general. There is a whole crypto valley in Zug now. 30% of ICOs are operated in Switzerland. The reason is that Switzerland has thrived for centuries on banking secrecy, and today with FATCA and exchange of fiscal info with EU, banking secrecy is dead. Regulators in Switzerland have understood that digital ledger technologies were a way to roll over this competitive advantage for the generations to come. Switzerland does not tax capital gains on crypto profits. The Finma has a very pragmatic approach. They have issued guidance- updated guidelines here. They let the business get organized and operate their analysis on a case per case basis. Only after getting a deep understanding of the market will they issue a global fintech license in 2019. This approach is much more realistic than legislations which try to regulate everything beforehand.
Italy new tax exemption. It’s a brand new fiscal exemption. Go to Aoste, get residency and you could be taxed a 100k/year for 10years. Yes, really.
Portugal What’s crazy in Europe is the lack of fiscal harmonization. Even if no one in Brussels dares admit it, every other country is doing fiscal dumping. Portugal is such a country and has proved very friendly fiscally speaking. I personally have a hard time trusting Europe. I have witnessed what happened in Greece over the last few years. Some of our ultra high net worth clients got stuck with capital controls. I mean no way you got out of crypto to have your funds confiscated at the next financial crisis! Anyway. FYI
Malta Generally speaking, if you get a residence somewhere you have to live there for a certain period of time. Being stuck in Italy is no big deal with Schengen Agreement, but in Malta it is a different story. In Malta, the ordinary residence scheme is more attractive than the HNWI residence scheme. Being an individual, you can hold a residence permit under this scheme and pay zero income tax in Malta in a completely legal way.
Monaco Not suitable for French citizens, but for other Ultra High Net worth individual, Monaco is worth considering. You need an account at a local bank as a proof of fortune, and this account generally has to be seeded with at least EUR500k. You also need a proof of residence. I do mean UHNI because if you don’t cash out minimum 30m it’s not interesting. Everything is expensive in Monaco. Real Estate is EUR 50k per square meter. A breakfast at Monte Carlo Bay hotel is 70 EUR. Monaco is sunny but sometimes it feels like a golden jail. Do you really want that for your kids?
Dubaï
  1. Set up a company in Dubaï, get your resident card.
  2. Spend one day every 6 month there
  3. ???
  4. Be tax free
US tricks Some Private banks in Geneva do have the license to manage the assets of US persons and U.S citizens. However, do not think it is a way to avoid paying taxes in the US. Opening an account at an authorized Swiss Private banks is literally the same tax-wise as opening an account at Fidelity or at Bank of America in the US. The only difference is that you will avoid all the horror stories. Horror stories are all real by the way. In Switzerland, if you build a decent case and answer all the questions and corroborate your case in depth, you will manage to convince compliance officers beforehand. When the money eventually hits your account, it is actually available and not frozen.
The IRS and FATCA require to file FBAR if an offshore account is open. However FBAR is a reporting requirement and does not have taxes related to holding an account outside the US. The taxes would be the same if the account was in the US. However penalties for non compliance with FBAR are very large. The tax liability management is actually performed through the management of the assets ( for exemple by maximizing long term capital gains and minimizing short term gains).
The case for Porto Rico. Full disclaimer here. I am not encouraging this. Have not collaborated on such tax avoidance schemes. if you are interested I strongly encourage you to seek a tax advisor and get a legal opinion. I am not responsible for anything written below. I am not going to say much because I am so afraid of uncle Sam that I prefer to humbly pass the hot potato to pwc From here all it takes is a good advisor and some creativity to be tax free on your crypto wealth if you are a US person apparently. Please, please please don’t ask me more. And read the disclaimer again.
Trust tricks Generally speaking I do not accept fringe fiscal situation because it puts me in a difficult situation to the banks I work with, and it is already difficult enough to defend a legit crypto case. Trust might be a way to optimize your fiscal situation. Belize. Bahamas. Seychelles. Panama, You name it. At the end of the day, what matters for Swiss Banks are the beneficial owner and the settlor. Get a legal opinion, get it done, and when you eventually knock at a private bank’s door, don’t say it was for fiscal avoidance you stupid ! You will get the door smashed upon you. Be smarter. It will work. My advice is just to have it done by a great tax specialist lawyer, even if it costs you some money, as the entity itself needs to be structured in a professional way. Remember that with trust you are dispossessing yourself off your wealth. Not something to be taken lightly.
“Anonymous” cash out. Right. I think I am not going into this topic, neither expose the ways to get it done. Pm me for details. I already feel a bit uncomfortable with all the info I have provided. I am just going to mention many people fear that crypto exchange might become reporting entities soon, and rightly so. This might happen anyday. You have been warned. FYI, this only works for non-US and large cash out.
The difference between traders an investors. Danmark, Holland and Germany all make a huge difference if you are a passive investor or if you are a trader. ICO is considered investing for instance and is not taxed, while trading might be considered as income and charged aggressively. I would try my best to protect you and put a focus on your investor profile whenever possible, so you don't have to pay 52% tax if you do not have to :D
Full cash out or partial cash out? People who have been sitting on crypto for long have grown an emotional and irrational link with their coins. They come to me and say, look, I have 50m in crypto but I would like to cash out 500k only. So first let me tell you that as a wealth manager my advice to you is to take some off the table. Doing a partial cash out is absolutely fine. The market is bullish. We are witnessing a redistribution of wealth at a global scale. Bitcoin is the real #occupywallstreet, and every one will discuss crypto at Xmas eve which will make the market even more supportive beginning 2018, especially with all hedge funds entering the scene. If you want to stay exposed to bitcoin and altcoins, and believe these techs will change the world, it’s just natural you want to keep some coins. In the meantime, if you have lived off pizzas over the last years, and have the means to now buy yourself an nice house and have an account at a private bank, then f***ing do it mate ! Buy physical gold with this account, buy real estate, have some cash at hands. Even though US dollar is worthless to your eyes, it’s good and convenient to have some. Also remember your wife deserves it ! And if you have no wife yet and you are socially awkward like the rest of us, then maybe cashing out partially will help your situation ;)
What the Private Banks expect. Joke aside, it is important you understand something. If you come around in Zurich to open a bank account and partially cash out, just don’t expect Private Banks will make an exception for you if you are small. You can’t ask them to facilitate your cash out, buy a 1m apartment with the proceeds of the sale, and not leave anything on your current account. It won’t work. Sadly, under 5m you are considered small in private banking. The bank is ok to let you open an account, provided that your kyc and compliance file are validated, but they will also want you to become a client and leave some money there to invest. This might me despicable, but I am just explaining you their rules. If you want to cash out, you should sell enough to be comfortable and have some left. Also expect the account opening to last at least 3-4 week if everything goes well. You can't just open an account overnight.
The cash out logistics. Cashing out 1m USD a day in bitcoin or more is not so hard.
Let me just tell you this: Even if you get a Tier 4 account with Kraken and ask Alejandro there to raise your limit over $100k per day, Even if you have a bitfinex account and you are willing to expose your wealth there, Even if you have managed to pass all the crazy due diligence at Bitstamp,
The amount should be fractioned to avoid risking your full wealth on exchange and getting slaughtered on the price by trading big quantities. Cashing out involves significant risks at all time. There is a security risk of compromising your keys, a counterparty risk, a fat finger risk. Let it be done by professionals. It is worth every single penny.
Most importantly, there is a major difference between trading on an exchange and trading OTC. Even though it’s not publicly disclosed some exchange like Kraken do have OTC desks. Trading on an exchange for a large amount will weight on the prices. Bitcoin is a thin market. In my opinion over 30% of the coins are lost in translation forever. Selling $10m on an exchange in a day can weight on the prices more than you’d think. And if you trade on a exchange, everything is shown on record, and you might wipe out the prices because on exchanges like bitstamp or kraken ultimately your counterparties are retail investors and the market depth is not huge. It is a bit better on Bitfinex. It is way better to trade OTC. Accessing the institutional OTC market is not easy, and that is also the reason why you should ask a regulated financial intermediary if we are talking about huge amounts.
Last point, always chose EUR as opposed to USD. EU correspondent banks won’t generally block institutional amounts. However we had the cases of USD funds frozen or delayed by weeks.
Most well-known OTC desks are Cumberlandmining (ask for Lucas), Genesis (ask for Martin), Bitcoin Suisse AG (ask for Niklas), circletrade, B2C2, or Altcoinomy (ask for Olivier)
Very very large whales can also set up escrow accounts for massive block trades. This world, where blocks over 30k BTC are exchanged between 2 parties would deserve a reddit thread of its own. Crazyness all around.
Your options: DIY or going through a regulated financial intermediary.
Execution trading is a job in itself. You have to be patient, be careful not to wipe out the order book and place limit orders, monitor the market intraday for spikes or opportunities. At big levels, for a large cash out that may take weeks, these kind of details will save you hundred thousands of dollars. I understand crypto holders are suspicious and may prefer to do it by themselves, but there are regulated entities who now offer the services. Besides, being a crypto millionaire is not a guarantee you will get institutional daily withdrawal limits at exchange. You might, but it will take you another round of KYC with them, and surprisingly this round might be even more aggressive that the ones at Private banks since exchange have gone under intense scrutiny by regulators lately.
The fees for cashing out through a regulated financial intermediary to help you with your cash out should be around 1-2% flat on the nominal, not more. And for this price you should get the full package: execution/monitoring of the trades AND onboarding in a private bank. If you are asked more, you are being abused.
Of course, you also have the option to do it yourself. It is a way more tedious and risky process. Compliance with the exchange, compliance with the private bank, trading BTC/fiat, monitoring the transfers…You will save some money but it will take you some time and stress. Further, if you approach a private bank directly, it will trigger a series of red flag to the banks. As I said in my previous post, they call a direct approach a “walk-in”. They will be more suspicious than if you were introduced by someone and won’t hesitate to show you high fees and load your portfolio with in-house products that earn more money to the banks than to you. Remember also most banks still do not understand crypto so you will have a lot of explanations to provide and you will have to start form scratch with them!
The paradox of crypto millionaires Most of my clients who made their wealth through crypto all took massive amount of risks to end up where they are. However, most of them want their bank account to be managed with a low volatility fixed income capital preservation risk profile. This is a paradox I have a hard time to explain and I think it is mainly due to the fact that most are distrustful towards banks and financial markets in general. Many clients who have sold their crypto also have a cash-out blues in the first few months. This is a classic situation. The emotions involved in hodling for so long, the relief that everything has eventually gone well, the life-changing dynamics, the difficulties to find a new motivation in life…All these elements may trigger a post cash-out depression. It is another paradox of the crypto rich who has every card in his hand to be happy, but often feel a bit sad and lonely. Sometimes, even though it’s not my job, I had to do some psychological support. A lot of clients have also become my friends, because we have the same age and went through the same “ordeal”. First world problem I know… Remember, cashing out is not the end. It’s actually the beginning. Don’t look back, don’t regret. Cash out partially, because it does not make sense to cash out in full, regret it and want back in. relax.
The race to cash out crypto billionaire and the concept of late exiter. The Winklevoss brothers are obviously the first of a series. There will be crypto billionaires. Many of them. At a certain level you can have a whole family office working for you to manage your assets and take care of your needs . However, let me tell you it’s is not because you made it so big that you should think you are a genius and know everything better than anyone. You should hire professionals to help you. Managing assets require some education around the investment vehicles and risk management strategies. Sorry guys but with all the respect I have for wallstreebet, AMD and YOLO stock picking, some discipline is necessary. The investors who have made money through crypto are generally early adopters. However I have started to see another profile popping up. They are not early adopters. They are late exiters. It is another way but just as efficient. Last week I met the first crypto millionaire I know who first bough bitcoin over 1000$. 55k invested at the beginning of this year. Late adopter & late exiter is a route that can lead to the million.
Last remarks. I know banks, bankers, and FIAT currencies are so last century. I know some of you despise them and would like to have them burn to the ground. With compliance officers taking over the business, I would like to start the fire myself sometimes. I hope this extensive guide has helped some of you. I am around if you need more details. I love my job despite all my frustration towards the banking industry because it makes me meet interesting people on a daily basis. I am a crypto enthusiast myself, and I do think this tech is here to stay and will change the world. Banks will have to adapt big time. Things have started to change already; they understand the threat is real. I can feel the generational gap in Geneva, with all these old bankers who don’t get what’s going on. They glaze at the bitcoin chart on CNBC in disbelief and they start to get it. This bitcoin thing is not a joke. Deep inside, as an early adopter who also intends to be a late exiter, as a libertarian myself, it makes me smile with satisfaction.
Cheers. @swisspb on telegram
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My protest at MtGox Offices - 5 to 7th February 2014, Tokyo, Japan.

Day 1 – Wednesday 5 February
After repeated and failed attempts to withdraw my BTC from MtGox, I decided to jump on a plane and pay them a visit in Tokyo.
After a 16 hr. flight from Australia I went straight to their offices, arriving at around 4pm. The receptionist in the lobby told me there was no one available to meet me and I should arrange an appointment.
I refused to leave and after about 15 mins or so, the receptionist handed me the telephone to speak with a member of MtGox support. The support person referred me to their website. After a ‘lively’ conversation I told him I wasn’t gong anywhere, I didn’t travel 16 hrs to read a website I could have read at home. I would wait for Mark Karpeles to come down.
Same thing happened 15 mins later, another call, more non-sense about technical issues, and a suggestion the authorities might have to be called. I told him great, I could lodge an official complaint against MtGox while they were here.
After some hours had passed, the building cleared out and the receptionists left for the night. I was alone in the lobby. Then at approximately 8 pm, I was suddenly greeted by Gonzague Gay-Bouchery, Manager Business Development, and Mark Karpeles right hand man.
I recognized him from some news articles. I thought great, and straight away put some burning questions to him:
Q1. What is causing the withdrawal delays?
• Well, because Gox is the best known of all the exchanges, we have been under the regulatory spotlight.
• This has created problems with government agencies, and also with our banking partners.
• There are also some ongoing investigations, which we cannot talk about.
Q.2 Sure, and this would explain the FIAT delays, but what about the BTC delays; you can’t blame that on anyone else.
• The BTC withdrawal issue is a technical one, and one that has previously affected the MtGox system, our engineers are working hard to resolve the problem.
• As of now, some BTC withdrawals were going through
• For those transactions that remain broken for a week, the balance of BTC will be returned to a customers MtGox account.
Q3. A great way to buy time for a liquidity problem?
• No, it’s a technical issue.
Q4. So why are so many of the input addresses feeding into transactions in the queue coming up empty?
• This is a complex technical issue to which neither of us know the answer
Q5. Try to explain it to me.
• Its technical
Q6. There are over 40,000 BTC in the withdrawal queue, isn’t that the electronic equivalent of a bank run?
• The 40,000 figure is not correct, and the goxreport isn’t accurate.
Q.7 But I actually obtained this data from Delerium’s website who is a gox employee / contractor / associate.
• I will have to look into that.
Q8. Why doesn’t Gox prove they are solvent by transferring a large quantity of BTC between two internal wallets like Mark previously did. Then we can all check it out on the blockchain and be reassured?
• The overwhelming majority of BTC are held in cold storage. Logistically and legally in would be difficult to replicate the transfer “trick” Mark previously employed at Gox to prove their solvency.
Q9. Try me, how hard is it, what exactly is involved?
• Obviously I can’t go into too much detail for security reasons, but it would involve physically obtaining them from 6 or more locations.
Q10. Well, why don’t u do it, isn’t this a critical situation?
• It’s not that straight foreword.
Q11. You do realize no-one believes the technical excuses for the delay in BTC?
• Mt Gox has the coins, it is a technical issue and we need people to be patient.
Q12. What is you view on the poll recently published by Coindesk on Mt Gox?
• Coindesk have a vendetta against MtGox.
Q13. But they one of the most trusted sources of news in the Bitcoin community.
• Some people have it out for Mt Gox.
Q14. How do you explain the vastly different prices that appear on Gox compared with other exchanges? It recently went to 25%.
• Some traders were responsible for the manufacturing the differential in an attempt to financially benefit from arbitrage.
Q15. But people exploiting the arbitrage opportunity would actually reduce the price differential, not widen it.
[I can’t recall receiving a response to this particular point]
Q16. Is MtGox manipulating the price by directly purchasing Bitcoins on their own exchange?
• No, MtGox is not permitted to do this.
[coincidently, almost immediately after this meeting the price on MtGox tanked]
Q17. People have a lot of money tied up in your exchange, and they don’t believe your excuses. All the evidence suggests something more serious going on at gox. You are playing with people’s lives here.
• All the coins are safe; this is merely a technical issue.
When I left the office that night, I wanted to believe that everything was indeed fine, and these were indeed some temporary technical glitches, but this view was somewhat influenced by the fact I still have BTC on their exchange. All the evidence appears to suggest something more serious.
For the record, I gave Gonzague an advance copy of this transcript and offered him the opportunity to have any of his answers amended if he felt I misrepresented him in any way. A member of his support team replied by stating he did not have any comment on my version of the conversation.
Day 2 – Thursday 6 February 2014
I arrived at MtGox early, approximately 8am, and stood outside with a sign reading “MtGox, where has my money gone”. I got some curious looks, and a lot of questions from passersby about my protest.
Then at approximately 9.20 am, Mark Karpeles himself came along carrying a large, and very fancy coffee in his hand that could have passed as a dessert. I immediately confronted him and told him we needed a chat. So he stopped to hear me out.
I told him he was playing with people’s lives, and some people stood to lose their entire savings. Like Gonzague told me the night before, he mentioned technical issues, and that he would look into my case.
Then 20mins later at around 9.40am Gonzague arrived. “Good news” he said, we have sorted out your account, go and check it online. After I got Wi-Fi connection back the hotel I discovered my failed BTC withdrawal transactions had been cancelled and all my BTC were put back in the one place in the world I didn’t want them: The MtGox website. Back to joining the queue of 40,000 other BTCs.
I think this was some sort of ironic joke. I quickly tried to withdraw them again; but surprise, surprise, stuck again.
By late evening, the majority of the other workers in the MtGox building had heard of my protest and were bringing me out sandwiches and beer, and inviting me to lunch. As it turns out, Japan is probably one of the better countries in the world to protest. Everyone is so friendly; I can see why the Goxies choose to set up shop here.
As the evening drew on, it looked like I would have do a late one to catch Mark again on the way out. However, at around 7.30pm, I was approached by a law professor from a local university who has written widely on bitcoin legal issues. He was on his way to a bitcoin “meet-up” and asked me to come along to tell my story to the other bitcoin enthusiasts. I was reluctant to leave the protest but was interested in what other Tokyo resident’s thought of MtGox.
When I arrived, everyone was very interested in hearing my story. There was a general consensus amongst the participants that MtGox was finished as an exchange. They acknowledged that MtGox had played an important role in propelling Bitcoin to what it is today, but its decline and ultimate closure was inevitable.
However, there was some divergent views on the reason for this, most people, including myself are of the view that bad business decisions and incompetence were primarily to blame, while others held the view that government restriction, and secret investigations were hampering MtGox’s ability to function efficiently. Who knows what the truth is, maybe it is a bit of both.
At the end of the day 2, there was a very worrying development, the data feed for the goxreport, and delerium’s MtGox transaction failure website were cut. Perhaps a final act of MtGox’s desperation to hide the truth.
Day 3 – Friday 7 February
I started my protest a little later today in the knowledge that most of the Goxies don’t start work until after 9am. Then there was an unexpected twist; another person showed up looking for Mark. He was an emissary of an early adopter and well known member of the bitcoin community, and was there to collect an eye watering amount of money.
My emotions were mixed on seeing this person; on one hand I was glad to see another protester to fight the good cause. On the other hand, my heart sank in the knowledge that if Mark isn’t paying off his old friends in the bitcoin community then what chance do small fry like me have?
As the emissary and I chatted, Mark Karpeles arrived, and we both confronted him, the conversation went on for some time and most of it conducted in French which I had trouble understanding. However I did mange to record the whole thing on video.
The episode only came to a halt when Gonzague appeared in the lobby and rescued Mark. Very soon after this point, MtGox released a statement announcing that all BTC withdrawals were suspended.
In conclusion, I think i just witnessed MtGox die today. I didn’t get my bitcoin, but glad I came and tried.
submitted by CoinSearcher to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

The simplest explanation is usually the right one (Occam's Razor): "Willy" was not a conspiracy. It was exactly what Mark Karpeles said it was: a bot/API for high value clients.

I'm a little surprised that so many people are jumping straight to conspiracy theories in the last 48 hours following the "Willy Report". It especially surprises me because Willy follows the exact same patterns that so many people here have theorized would be done by "whales".
Imagine you are a high value trader or company. You want to enter bitcoin or increase your position. Do you really think you would simply open up a regular trading account on MtGox, put millions of dollars into your web account, and start making million dollar trades? Absolutely no way. I've worked for two large Wall Street banks, and I can tell you flat out that high value clients have access to products and services that "normal" people do not. High value clients have dedicated staff to service them, they get taken out to dinners and events, they have exceptions done for them, they simply operate outside of the normal world that you and I live in.
Willy didn't pay fees or fiat because it operated outside the purview of what a normal trader would have to do. High value clients would have direct relationships with MtGox, and would likely have special fee structure in place that they would pay to MtGox separately and at a different time than trades. Willy didn't back up trades with fiat because fiat was likely wired to MtGox separately, in bulk.
Willy only bought because these high value clients weren't looking to really "trade". They were looking to enter the market, and likely couldn't find enough early adopters off-market to facilitate their needs. So, they had to go on-market. Second Market has publicly stated that they started having issues finding off-market individuals to buy from. What then? Just stop buying? Absolutely not. They instead needed to start coming on-market. However, you can't simply start making buy orders for several millions dollars. So instead, MtGox would offer an automated API that was directly connected to their servers (just like Mark said) and could make small buys at frequent intervals so as to try to not influence the market too much and cause the price to go skyrocketing.
Willy had "??" in data fields because Willy likely facilitated several different clients at once. There is no grand conspiracy there.
Again, I'm surprised that people aren't coming to these simple conclusions, especially since this is exactly how all of us have assumed "whales" work. What we're seeing in Willy is exactly what we expected to see in whales.
Also, does anyone really think that Willy, a bot that was a small percentage of MtGox's volume, could really single-handedly incite an entire bubble when there were at least 2 or 3 other similarly sized exchanges? The truth is that Willy was just one form of high value clients entering the market on one exchange. Other exchanges likely have their own forms of "Willies" that contributed to the bubble just like it did on MtGox. And trust me, those "Willies" are no more conspiratorial than this MtGox Willy is.
submitted by watabtme to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Trying to get 40,000 BTC out of the MtGOX exchange... and failing.

Day 1 – Wednesday 5 February
After repeated and failed attempts to withdraw my BTC from MtGox, I decided to jump on a plane and pay them a visit in Tokyo.
After a 16 hr. flight from Australia I went straight to their offices, arriving at around 4pm. The receptionist in the lobby told me there was no one available to meet me and I should arrange an appointment.
I refused to leave and after about 15 mins or so, the receptionist handed me the telephone to speak with a member of MtGox support. The support person referred me to their website. After a ‘lively’ conversation I told him I wasn’t gong anywhere, I didn’t travel 16 hrs to read a website I could have read at home. I would wait for Mark Karpeles to come down.
Same thing happened 15 mins later, another call, more non-sense about technical issues, and a suggestion the authorities might have to be called. I told him great, I could lodge an official complaint against MtGox while they were here.
After some hours had passed, the building cleared out and the receptionists left for the night. I was alone in the lobby. Then at approximately 8 pm, I was suddenly greeted by Gonzague Gay-Bouchery, Manager Business Development, and Mark Karpeles right hand man.
I recognized him from some news articles. I thought great, and straight away put some burning questions to him:
Q1. What is causing the withdrawal delays?
• Well, because Gox is the best known of all the exchanges, we have been under the regulatory spotlight.
• This has created problems with government agencies, and also with our banking partners.
• There are also some ongoing investigations, which we cannot talk about.
Q.2 Sure, and this would explain the FIAT delays, but what about the BTC delays; you can’t blame that on anyone else.
• The BTC withdrawal issue is a technical one, and one that has previously affected the MtGox system, our engineers are working hard to resolve the problem.
• As of now, some BTC withdrawals were going through
• For those transactions that remain broken for a week, the balance of BTC will be returned to a customers MtGox account.
Q3. A great way to buy time for a liquidity problem?
• No, it’s a technical issue.
Q4. So why are so many of the input addresses feeding into transactions in the queue coming up empty?
• This is a complex technical issue to which neither of us know the answer
Q5. Try to explain it to me.
• Its technical
Q6. There are over 40,000 BTC in the withdrawal queue, isn’t that the electronic equivalent of a bank run?
• The 40,000 figure is not correct, and the goxreport isn’t accurate.
Q.7 But I actually obtained this data from Delerium’s website who is a gox employee / contractor / associate.
• I will have to look into that.
Q8. Why doesn’t Gox prove they are solvent by transferring a large quantity of BTC between two internal wallets like Mark previously did. Then we can all check it out on the blockchain and be reassured?
• The overwhelming majority of BTC are held in cold storage. Logistically and legally in would be difficult to replicate the transfer “trick” Mark previously employed at Gox to prove their solvency.
Q9. Try me, how hard is it, what exactly is involved?
• Obviously I can’t go into too much detail for security reasons, but it would involve physically obtaining them from 6 or more locations.
Q10. Well, why don’t u do it, isn’t this a critical situation?
• It’s not that straight foreword.
Q11. You do realize no-one believes the technical excuses for the delay in BTC?
• Mt Gox has the coins, it is a technical issue and we need people to be patient.
Q12. What is you view on the poll recently published by Coindesk on Mt Gox?
• Coindesk have a vendetta against MtGox.
Q13. But they one of the most trusted sources of news in the Bitcoin community.
• Some people have it out for Mt Gox.
Q14. How do you explain the vastly different prices that appear on Gox compared with other exchanges? It recently went to 25%.
• Some traders were responsible for the manufacturing the differential in an attempt to financially benefit from arbitrage.
Q15. But people exploiting the arbitrage opportunity would actually reduce the price differential, not widen it.
[I can’t recall receiving a response to this particular point]
Q16. Is MtGox manipulating the price by directly purchasing Bitcoins on their own exchange?
• No, MtGox is not permitted to do this.
[coincidently, almost immediately after this meeting the price on MtGox tanked]
Q17. People have a lot of money tied up in your exchange, and they don’t believe your excuses. All the evidence suggests something more serious going on at gox. You are playing with people’s lives here.
• All the coins are safe; this is merely a technical issue.
When I left the office that night, I wanted to believe that everything was indeed fine, and these were indeed some temporary technical glitches, but this view was somewhat influenced by the fact I still have BTC on their exchange. All the evidence appears to suggest something more serious.
For the record, I gave Gonzague an advance copy of this transcript and offered him the opportunity to have any of his answers amended if he felt I misrepresented him in any way. A member of his support team replied by stating he did not have any comment on my version of the conversation.
Day 2 – Thursday 6 February 2014
I arrived at MtGox early, approximately 8am, and stood outside with a sign reading “MtGox, where has my money gone”. I got some curious looks, and a lot of questions from passersby about my protest.
Then at approximately 9.20 am, Mark Karpeles himself came along carrying a large, and very fancy coffee in his hand that could have passed as a dessert. I immediately confronted him and told him we needed a chat. So he stopped to hear me out.
I told him he was playing with people’s lives, and some people stood to lose their entire savings. Like Gonzague told me the night before, he mentioned technical issues, and that he would look into my case.
Then 20mins later at around 9.40am Gonzague arrived. “Good news” he said, we have sorted out your account, go and check it online. After I got Wi-Fi connection back the hotel I discovered my failed BTC withdrawal transactions had been cancelled and all my BTC were put back in the one place in the world I didn’t want them: The MtGox website. Back to joining the queue of 40,000 other BTCs.
I think this was some sort of ironic joke. I quickly tried to withdraw them again; but surprise, surprise, stuck again.
By late evening, the majority of the other workers in the MtGox building had heard of my protest and were bringing me out sandwiches and beer, and inviting me to lunch. As it turns out, Japan is probably one of the better countries in the world to protest. Everyone is so friendly; I can see why the Goxies choose to set up shop here.
As the evening drew on, it looked like I would have do a late one to catch Mark again on the way out. However, at around 7.30pm, I was approached by a law professor from a local university who has written widely on bitcoin legal issues. He was on his way to a bitcoin “meet-up” and asked me to come along to tell my story to the other bitcoin enthusiasts. I was reluctant to leave the protest but was interested in what other Tokyo resident’s thought of MtGox.
When I arrived, everyone was very interested in hearing my story. There was a general consensus amongst the participants that MtGox was finished as an exchange. They acknowledged that MtGox had played an important role in propelling Bitcoin to what it is today, but its decline and ultimate closure was inevitable.
However, there was some divergent views on the reason for this, most people, including myself are of the view that bad business decisions and incompetence were primarily to blame, while others held the view that government restriction, and secret investigations were hampering MtGox’s ability to function efficiently. Who knows what the truth is, maybe it is a bit of both.
At the end of the day 2, there was a very worrying development, the data feed for the goxreport, and delerium’s MtGox transaction failure website were cut. Perhaps a final act of MtGox’s desperation to hide the truth.
Day 3 – Friday 7 February
I started my protest a little later today in the knowledge that most of the Goxies don’t start work until after 9am. Then there was an unexpected twist; another person showed up looking for Mark. He was an emissary of an early adopter and well known member of the bitcoin community, and was there to collect an eye watering amount of money.
My emotions were mixed on seeing this person; on one hand I was glad to see another protester to fight the good cause. On the other hand, my heart sank in the knowledge that if Mark isn’t paying off his old friends in the bitcoin community then what chance do small fry like me have?
As the emissary and I chatted, Mark Karpeles arrived, and we both confronted him, the conversation went on for some time and most of it conducted in French which I had trouble understanding. However I did mange to record the whole thing on video.
The episode only came to a halt when Gonzague appeared in the lobby and rescued Mark. Very soon after this point, MtGox released a statement announcing that all BTC withdrawals were suspended.
In conclusion, I think i just witnessed MtGox die today. I didn’t get my bitcoin, but glad I came and tried.
submitted by kkodaxeroo to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Chinese comments are translated to English: "What Happened At The Satoshi Roundtable"

Inherent flaw...
This saying... If there were no inside trading, I would not believe it. I hope miners could be more responsible, and so that bitcoin is not strangled in the cradle.
Whatever plunged downwards so much would also go up afterwards. How is that related to short-term block reward? Not to mention hash rate reduction has little impact on block mining, and the duration is short. As of today's network and hardware, why can't 2MB be achieved? Although other techs like LN can scale. On-chain scaling is essential, which is irreplaceable.
Those who keep their eyes closed for immediate interests, they will be eliminated sooner or later. No matter how many guns are in their hands.
This (the author) is a true bitcoin practitioner. Shame on those domestic trolls attacking him.
Domestic miners have already taken the short position. So they still are the winners.
Bitcoin price drop due to hash rate reduction has happened once before, when price hit ¥900 (translator's note: Jan 14 2015). But at the same time the number of coins being mined also decreased, which in turn reduced selling pressure. And hash rate regained slowly. So Brian is not familiar with bitcoin mining. This is his flaw.
(Reply to Wu Gang)I agree with CoinBase CEO Brain's views
(Reply to Wu Gang) Why hash rate decrease will lead to reduced mined coins? It is just two weeks adjustment period. Once the difficulty is adjusted, numbers of coins mined will be the same as before.
And obviously you evaded the main points. The point is hash rate drop will cause 4-6 weeks of congestion, which will make people lose faith. Will reduced coins mined make up for it?
Now I prefer to believe that you have some secrete interest behind the scenes. Or if these recent statements by you is really your true judgement and your understanding of technology, I seriously doubt with your leadership, how far can HaoBTC go.
Market position gives those big bitcoin players certain power. In a short period of time, they are movers and shakers. But that's at the cost of the loss of market share. MtGox was so, Core will be, too, miners and mining pools are no exception!
Repost Bitcoin KingOfMoney's comment
(Reply to Bitcoin KingOfMoney) This guy's so full of ambition.
(reply to Zhao LeTian) Even Children three years old are able to understand why those domestic bosses would oppose that (Classic). Only shows dirty secrets hidden behind the curtain.
(reply to FishSpecial) Yes, Coinbase CEO is a political player, trying to completely control Bitcoin. His resorts are very dangerous.
(reply to P2PBUCKS) Show me your proof. Shall I believe what you said just because you said it? I think he's (Brian) got reasonable points.
(reply to P2PBUCKS) You're saying conspiracy theories again.
(reply to Zhao LeTian) Now you do not believe. Wait to see.
(reply to Zhao LeTian) To hinder the process of Bitcoin the debate finding a conclusion, HAOBTC's men are “work extremely hard”. why? why?
(reply to Zhao LeTian's previous commment: I(Zhao) agree with CoinBase CEO Brain's views )
Although I agree that Bitcoin prices will rise. But if reward halved and price did not go up, Bitcoin will not work fine. The threats within the logic and fear are too bad. Bitcoin has its own decentralized POW adjustment method. With previous halving experiences, the Bitcoin ecosystem won't be significantly affected if prices did not rise. Bitcoin has POW self-regulating system, so bitcoin can worth ten thousand USD.
(reply to Wu Gang)
The points I agree with brain is that only under the dictatorship can we have so-called >90% "consensus". Forking is no big deal. It's not a split but an election.
If you can't refute with reason, you just simply launch personal attacks (calling names). Many of our countryman are used to this sort of technique.
Price is going to drop again.
(reply to Song HuanPing) Note its not "again", its "already". OK, You big slick.
How low the price will go so I can buy long?
(reply to Song HuanPing) Song HuanPing: All you should do is Short! Short! Short! So you could be a winner in life [insidious emojo]
Oh, they need no standpoint, they are happy to remain the status quo, and do not want to see BTC rise. Otherwise, it will cause runs on banks and lead to bankruptcy. (*HaoBTC providing bank service for bitcoin)
(reply to Zhao LeTian) All right.
(reply to Zhao LeTian)
Bitcoin is a scientific system, rather than a political network. How to protect Bitcoin network security, we need a consensus system. Elections are only politicians' ways to seize control of the Bitcoin. With less than 90% agree, hash rate will split, it will allow the existence of two kinds of bitcoin for a period of time. That two types of coin in offchain wallets can be withdrawn. That will risk the entire community of being attacked. Scientific systems can be tested to confirm the feasibility through experiments.
(reply to Wu Gang)
On the contrary, where there are people, there are politics. Politics is everywhere. You can suspect other people's point of view, but you should not suspect other people's motives. So getting used to produce conspiracy theories.
repost the above Zhao's weibo.
(reply to Zhao LeTian)
You are pointing at the wrong guy. Ha ha, politics is not bad, but what I mean is that bitcoin is a scientific system, not a political one. Scientific systems should deal with things in accordance with scientific and systematic ways. In fact, I suddenly found that, in fact, the fundamental difference here is to define if Bitcoin is a scientific system or a political one. Bitcoin is scientific systems to bring freedom to people.
I only believe data, no others.
(reply to Wu Gang)
And even in science, there is no absolutely correct theories. We always have parallel(relative) theories. And the evolution of the old and new theories and systems. The fact that being intolerant of different opinions is the biggest joke.
StarryNight (HaoBTC Wu Gang) mostly stand in the perspective of his own bank. The fear for forking is worst for those coin counterfeiting exchanges, and the presidents of bitcoin banks! So ~~~
Flow with the trend. No one can stop it. Reverse the trends of bitcoin, cis and live, Nizhe death. Its your own choice to make!
(reply to Zhao LeTian)
There have always been differences. There are also differences in science. But ultimately only one of many will be proved to be correct science.
¥900 followed with a rebound is because the market bottomed out. A slight drop of hash rate leaded to longer block generation, and a slight reduction of newly mined coins. It is almost negligible to price.
You did not fully grasp what he was saying. Is any congestion in previous halvings? What was the trading volume when last halving took place?
(reply to Wu Gang) Bitcoin is a currency system, it has millions of users with a market cap of billions of dollars. It is no longer an early stage scientific experiment. Bitcoin is not the core's private plaything. Core has no power to decide how bitcoin's future should be like, and what route to go. Recently our party stated with their scientific proof that our living areas are better without the walls, and should be open to the roads and streets. Do you support that too?
(reply to Song HuanPing) You've said its gonna drop last time when ¥1700
Dont mess with me. It is dropping all the time.
(reply to Wu Gang)
But the core cannot prove the "science" they believes in to be the only correct one. When you can't prove it, and meanwhile force your will on bitcoin and users. This behaviour is no different from Hitler's genocide on the basis of "scientific" racial theory .
I highly endorse Coinbase CEO's views
To Wu Gang, for the company's immediate interests, and go against 2MB plan. The eyes of some are really short-sighted! DOS operating system can not go far with only 640KB of memory. The same truth holds that Bitcoin cannot always be limited to 1MB blocks! Nor should we deem Bitcoin programming sacred, like other people can not develop it. Competing teams are going to show up.
(reply to HappyFlyLong)
Please discuss only which views are correct or not. Trying to attack others with guessing their motives is what idiots would do ...
I always believed P2PBUCKS, and thank you for the reminders. But it is recommended to tell with reason.
Can't agree more.
A grand waterfall is coming
Forking is not allowed? Should it be better if Satoshi decided to go closed-source?
(reply to KillBtc's comment: To hinder the process of Bitcoin the debate finding a conclusion, HAOBTC's men are “work extremely hard”. why? why?)
Toxic Tumour of the coin industry.
haobtc... Beyond redemption
[Conspiracy] Coinbase CEO just want to control BTC with the help of LTC's creator? To break other's monopoly with your own. This is power struggle, we people have seen much more like this. We are also very good at it.
Edit: typo and grammar
BTC: 1JpazvbnCqFzhLvaVncoCkbWXNoWbgeS6Q
submitted by nextblast to btc [link] [comments]

Real life stories of people screwed at Gox...

Source: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=476535.msg5255853
Hello,
I am in Japan and have deposited 12.499 million Yen (about USD 122,000) at MtGox from October to December 2013. I currently have 175 BTCs and 13,000 Yen in cash at their exchange. I also have a Premium status account.
Please let me know how to proceed. That was most of my retirement money.
Hi.
My name is xxx and I live in Sweden, Malmö. I am writing for me and for my girlfriend and my dad. We all bought and sold bitcoins a last years and made some money. We have taken out some money when we need to and right now me and my girlfriend was going to buy a house and start a family so we tried to withdraw the money in January. Since the money didn't show up after 4 weeks I tried to contact them but still nothing. I hope that together with you and some others get at least some money back. If you need any proof of the withdrawals or such I can provide some of it. We had in total $49000 on the accounts.
we are unsure how to proceed.
Help!
I have about 90 BTC and no USD in my mtgox account, which I would very much like to receive back at some point. It's only just sinking in that it might all be gone.. I can't believe I waited so long before getting it out somewhere safe, but.. here we are.
Hey there, I am interested in being a plaintiff as well. I had about 70k in Mtgox in Dec due to the price explosion in November and attempted to withdraw some funds since I wasn't comfortable having that amount hosted there. I ran into the withdrawal issue back in Dec and opened a support ticket in which I got the run around until they finally officially announced what the problem was. As the moment, I don't have any $$ in Mtgox but around 180 BTC. My stomach has been in knots all week :-(
Hello,
at the time that the withdrawal stopped I have over $3MM in fiat at Gox. I now have ~5,400 BTC there. It maybe sizeable enough for your attorneys to consider taking on a BTC claim? In any case, if they think that I can sue based on my fiat balance prior to withdrawal suspension, based on the idea that any subsequent trading was essentially fraudulent, well then I would be interested in join the effort.
Hi,
My name is xxxxxx and I am from California (if that matters). I have about 650 BTC in Gox. I haven't slept in days and haven't been able to tell my wife how much I've lost. I was an early adopter, just mining in my basement, and I can't imagine all of my time and work vanishing like this. Please contact me with what I need to do
I am a French citizen. I would like to know how to try and join you in reclaiming my lost funds. I had almost 100.000 EUR in my account. It will be a complete disaster for me if it is stolen.
I cannot reasonably afford to lose the funds I have at Mtgox. I currently hold the majority in USD, but also significant amounts of EUR and BTC.
I would like to join your action lawsui as co-paintiff. I try to keep this short since you are probably getting tons of PMs.
I'm resident of Germany and I'm waiting for ~5700 Euros (~7800 US$) to be withdrawn by MTGOX. I also have about 9 BTCs on my account there. I successfully received a MTGOX-withdrawal of 990 EUR on 2013/12/30, which was ordered on 2013/12/03.
I'm a student and this is almost all of my money I have left (I actually have a lot of debt, which I intended to pay back with that money). I'm really panicking right now and not sure what to do!!!
I'm in Tokyo as well and I lost ~8 BTC and 500,000 in JPY. Please let me know how your case progresses and whether at any time you think it would be possible to get others involved. I really hope I can get at least some of that money back. I need it.
I am very interested in your proposal of suing Mt.Gox to get what is ours.
I would need to sue for more than 70000EUR or over 90000USD. The ammount depends of the bitcoin price - not the manipulated Mt.Gox price, but like the Bitcoin price index on coinbase.com. Although it would be best if Mt.Gox let me simply withdraw my more than 170BTC.
So many people are angry about Mt.Gox and me too. They act like scamers.
I have CSV's, screenshots + multiple records everything for owning 994.90514041 BTC through my mtgox accounts.
Hi, I had 100BTC but a friend had $14000 USD on Gox. Can you put me into contact with whomever is organising the class action lawsuit?
I had some 125BTC & $1000 on MtGox. I'd prefer to recover the BTC but if not possible, USD is better than nothing. Technically at the last price the total is well above the $10000 limit. Can you count me in? What should I do next?
Hey, I'd like to get involved in this as well. Gox has yet to deliver a withdrawal of funds from late last year and currently has all my coins locked up because of their withdrawal lock. Email is below, let me know if you need any other info. Thanks,
(originally I tried to withdraw $30,000.00, but Mt.Gox cancelled my withdraw and asked me to change to GBP. Funds never arrived Mt.Gox confirmed they were unable to wire funds, but funds are not re-instated to my account. Mt.Gox admits in the e-mail funds are mine.)
I'm interested in joining as a co-P in Japan, I have $200k+ in cash balance (no bitcoins) locked up on their site right now. Let me know how many other co-Ps will be represented and the estimated legal costs. Do we have an update on the status of Mt Gox? They haven't filed for bankruptcy just yet. I'm a verified member so I'm thinking they might resume operations and just send us a check, but I'm interested in others' opinions on that.
I found your post just today after the Gox closed the site. I had 10,200 USD with them, which I traded just last week for gox coin. I initially deposited USD from bank account on November 2013, and traded on Gox just about 2 weeks ago, not knowing there was a trouble to withdraw any BTC from them. I do have screen shots from last week from trading and all my history since November 2013. My initial deposits in November have been 8000 USD and 2200 USD, so whatever trading I did in last weeks was for vain since gox did not let any BTC out of the site. Current standing on my account is about 27 BTC and around 2200 USD but since gox coin was never a real BTC, as I just learnt recently, I consider Gox owing me 10200 USD which I initially deposited.
I wish to be include in the class action lawsuit, I an non-us (EU) and have lost 50 BTC and 24,600€.
I have 93BTC at stake in mtgox. Money used to acquire it was 29k EUR.
I would like to join the lawsuit if there is any chance of getting the either the BTC or EURO-equivalent at the price determined at the time of judgement.
I want to participate. I have 85 BTC on Mt Gox.
Please update me and let me know, which further steps I have to take to participate.
I had $28500 in, and purchased 50btc @ $570. So now I have the 49.7btc still in and no fiat. Have been waiting for withdrawal to resume to clean myself of gox forever.
I was very lucky, having pulled out the bulk of my btc holdings from gox in mid-January.
Please respond if whether I can or can't participate.
i too am a Gox victim. I have 69 BTC stuck on Gox. At this stage i would be very reluctant to take such a haircut and convert to USD.
Has the lawyer you hired totally ruled out BTC cases? Is he even taking on new cases?
I have roughly $100K in my account, so it might be worth it for the lawyer to squeeze me in.
I have 50BTC in MTGOX and would be interested in joining. If yes, how large would the fees be?
If Mtgox is indeed gone and finished, I would like to know what the status of this suit is and who I can contact regarding it. I had about 111.777 BTC on gox.
I have 158 btc on MtGox and would like to take part to your lawsuit.
Most of our savings were in bitcoin, and at market rates on other exchanges, I had over $40,000 while my friends had $300,000 to 400,000.
I have 154 BTC and 0 USD in MTGOX.
I live in Malta but would like to know what my options are for joining your case?
I'm a very credible trader who pays his American taxes yearly. I feel so stupid for holding the majority of my BTC exposure on mt gox in hindsight......
I have 301 BTC on mt gox and under $10 USD, my account on gox was a verified account as well.
TL;DR: Maybe they were foolish for trusting the community too much, but they didn't deserve what they got.
submitted by cardevitoraphicticia to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Bitcoin history: The BearWhale of 2012

The "BearWhale" recently crashed the price of Bitcoin by cashing out nearly $8 million worth of BTC. But, just as recently as two and a half years ago, all it took to crash the price was a measly $13,000 investment in 10:1 leveraged Bitcoin shorts.
Unfortunately for the person who made this bet, though, he (or she) made the mistake of bragging about it, posting a screenshot of the highly-leveraged position on the BitcoinTalk forum. Unlike today, when we wonder who the BearWhale may be, the "BearWhale of 2012" openly identified not only himself, but his financial position as well. This meant that everyone could see the exact point at which his bet on the price of Bitcoin going down would be force-liquidated, and he would lose everything.
So that's exactly what happened. The original posts have since been deleted, but another trader (and rather perturbed Bitcoin supporter) saw the post of the leveraged "BearWhale of 2012" bragging about shorting Bitcoin, and decided to buy a large amount of BTC instead, raising the price and forcing a margin call on the position. He then posted saying he had done so, decidedly slaying the "BearWhale of 2012."
The result was immediate, and hilarious. Given the somewhat shoddy and unreliable nature of Bitcoin trading platforms at the time, most traders had no idea what had happened. MtGox had a live data feed that was prone to melting down at the most inopportune times. As far as most traders could tell, the price had just inexplicably gone down, and then just as inexplicably gone back up, while in the mean time many leveraged positions had been thrown into disarray. Many were blaming the trading platform, Bitcoinica, for a glitch. But word of the dueling shenanigans spread on the forum, and most quickly realized that the reality of Bitcoin trading was "far more entertaining than some TV drama".
In the aftermath, the volume and zeal of Bitcoin speculative trading was dampened considerably by this episode, and the price stabilized for a lengthy period. No doubt many lawyers and accountants were consulted, and probably even some lawmakers contacted, due to money earned and lost. Leveraged Bitcoin trading would eventually disappear for a time. Today, though, it is in the process of returning. The players have mostly all changed, but the game remains much the same.
submitted by benjamindees to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Bitstamp's streaming API, and exploitation possibilities it might reveal

TL;DR: Bitstamp's undocumented streaming API seems to reveal out-of-order trade execution that can be exploited to steal margins from large buys/sells.
Bitstamp has an undocumented streaming API. You should know what it seems to reveal about Bitstamp's order matching.
It's not surprising that I see trades on the stream about 10s before I see them on BitcoinWisdom etc. (I haven't compared that to the latency of direct API polling; my lag to BW and processing lag at BW's end might be included there.) That's already not fair. Bitstamp should document the stream, or delay it.
Before I tell you what is surprising, a quick detour: Bitstamp only provides limit orders. "Instant" (aka Market) orders are simulated by placing a limit order with the limit set to whatever was the top of the opposite side of the book at the time, and as anyone who has tried to trade at Bitstamp during a rally/drop will know, the top often moves before your "instant" order hits the books and therefore doesn't execute. People work around this by manually or automatically placing limit orders with limits that go beyond the top of the opposite side of the book, ensuring that they'll match something.
Suppose someone places such a limit order. Rather than lock the book until the order is matched and produces a trade, the order is placed on the book and the book is allowed to cross. People have reported here on Reddit seeing this before. That's kind of surprising, but perhaps you're thinking they ensure things still execute in order. Well, the stream I'm watching includes both order and trade events, and I typically see orders on the stream anywhere between ~2.5s and ~8s ("the window") before they match and produce a trade; if you're only trading by watching BitcoinWisdom and others, I see things happen as much as 18s ahead of you.
What properly surprises me is that within the window, if another limit order gets placed with a limit even higher than the first before the first has matched, that second order can execute before the first. An example from real stream data follows. The best ask (order_type=1) is 202.10, set by the first order creation I've included. received is added by me on receipt; the rest comes from the live stream. Some non-participating orders away from the book top have been removed for clarity.
{"received": "1383077092.151", "type": "order_created", "price": "202.10", "amount": "3.00700000", "datetime": "1383077091", "id": 8595046, "order_type": 1} {"received": "1383077095.876", "type": "order_created", "price": "221.13", "amount": "0.19825903", "datetime": "1383077095", "id": 8595048, "order_type": 0} {"received": "1383077098.420", "type": "order_created", "price": "222.65", "amount": "0.63000000", "datetime": "1383077098", "id": 8595051, "order_type": 0} {"received": "1383077100.908", "type": "order_deleted", "price": "222.65", "amount": "0.00000000", "datetime": "1383077099", "id": 8595051, "order_type": 0} {"received": "1383077100.918", "type": "order_changed", "price": "202.10", "amount": "2.37700000", "datetime": "1383077096", "id": 8595046, "order_type": 1} {"received": "1383077100.964", "type": "trade", "price": 202.09999999999999, "amount": 0.63, "id": 1698465} {"received": "1383077101.016", "type": "order_deleted", "price": "221.13", "amount": "0.00000000", "datetime": "1383077099", "id": 8595048, "order_type": 0} {"received": "1383077101.051", "type": "order_changed", "price": "202.10", "amount": "2.17874097", "datetime": "1383077096", "id": 8595046, "order_type": 1} {"received": "1383077101.063", "type": "trade", "price": 202.09999999999999, "amount": 0.19825903, "id": 1698466} 
Bid 8595048 for 0.19825903 @ 221.13 would cross the book, and should match immediately, but orders continue to be accepted and no trade appears.
Bid 8595051 for 0.63 @ 222.65 would also cross the book, but since it arrived ~2.544 seconds later — and assuming FIFO matching — it shouldn't execute until after 8595048. But it executes first. In this case, fortunately there's enough depth to the ask that both fill at the price they should, but this out-of-order execution occurs even when there isn't enough depth; I can give real examples from the stream but they make less clear examples because they tend to involve multiple fills.
Imagine that you're watching this stream and you see the FBI dump the SR coins, and that the window is wide enough for you to react. You could place a limit order that beats theirs, being sure to sell your coins before theirs crash the exchange rate.
Alternatively you could always maintain a buy order in the book, far enough away that you can maintain a constant distance from the best bid but close enough that a whale might fill it. When you see a whale's sell, you snipe a high sell by beating their limit. The whale's order then goes through and fills some other bids, and your low buy. You effectively just made a high sale and made a low buy with no risk at all. You could do this on both sides of the book at once.
Why document this instead of just taking advantage of it? I hate the idea that some traders are playing with loaded dice. If the engine has to behave in this funky way, it should be documented; ideally it should simply behave as everyone expects it to anyway. Why post under a throwaway? While I've made no attempt to exploit this, I wouldn't put it past Bitstamp to confiscate my balances and close my account; that's simpler for them than checking whether I did exploit it. (In case I choose to link this to my real account later or you need me to prove I'm me, I can provide a pre-image for e591ed9a365ad73d29dc22f10b170fff and d4bd7f9db698c81ba31ce544d2025834.) Why not report it to Bitstamp first? Bitstamp has a poor track record for addressing bugs reported in their engine, probably needs to be embarrassed into doing something, and they can easily just disable the stream. I've left stream access details undocumented, for now. EDIT: described on bitcointalk (via Pusher) as well as below (direct WebSocket access).
I'd ask Bitstamp to confirm whether they believe this is a problem, say what they plan to do about it (if anything) and I invite them to PM me here in the unlikely event that they need more info.
I'd also really like them to make their stream useable, along with a single orderbook snapshot, to maintain an accurate of the orderbook without having to make unreliable inferences — i.e. include prev_amount (or amount_delta) in order_deleted and order_changed, and also include in each trade event the order IDs that matched. Having these things would bring it towards or beyond MtGox's stream, which provides at least the remaining volume at the affected pricepoint. It'd also be lovely if the ungrouped orderbook snapshot included order IDs and could be explicitly pinned between two stream order_foo events for easier syncing (the timestamp doesn't seem to accurately match the stream's datetimes, and requires guesswork). And a pony and a winnebago and the moon on a stick.
submitted by serves-two to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Class action suit cancelled. Some personal accounts of funds people lost included...

Source: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=476535.msg5255853
FINAL UPDATE
I'm sure that everyone is aware that MtGox declared bankruptcy yesterday. As such, our lawsuit is off and we, like everyone, will be filing a claim in bankruptcy court. Words cannot express my (our) disappointment in this whole debacle. Over the last week I have spoken to people from all around the world, many of whom are now facing financial catastrophe - and it is heartbreaking. It is especially disheartening given the noble endeavor we had set out to achieve. To create a financial system based on open source principals that would level the playing field for people around the world and liberate them from the various corrupt central banks sabotaging their success and financial freedom. Yet here we are, betrayed by a trust system similar to what we sought to avoid. Ultimately, I still believe in cryptocurrency technology and how it will revolutionize the financial world; but it is clear that still has a lot of growing up to do - both the protocol and the service ecosystem. As a testament to the REAL PEOPLE who've been left in the wake of this lesson, I'd like to share with you a small sample of the personal messages I received (personal information removed).
Hello,
I am in Japan and have deposited 12.499 million Yen (about USD 122,000) at MtGox from October to December 2013. I currently have 175 BTCs and 13,000 Yen in cash at their exchange. I also have a Premium status account.
Please let me know how to proceed. That was most of my retirement money.
Hi.
My name is xxx and I live in Sweden, Malmö. I am writing for me and for my girlfriend and my dad. We all bought and sold bitcoins a last years and made some money. We have taken out some money when we need to and right now me and my girlfriend was going to buy a house and start a family so we tried to withdraw the money in January. Since the money didn't show up after 4 weeks I tried to contact them but still nothing. I hope that together with you and some others get at least some money back. If you need any proof of the withdrawals or such I can provide some of it. We had in total $49000 on the accounts.
we are unsure how to proceed.
Help!
I have about 90 BTC and no USD in my mtgox account, which I would very much like to receive back at some point. It's only just sinking in that it might all be gone.. I can't believe I waited so long before getting it out somewhere safe, but.. here we are.
Hey there, I am interested in being a plaintiff as well. I had about 70k in Mtgox in Dec due to the price explosion in November and attempted to withdraw some funds since I wasn't comfortable having that amount hosted there. I ran into the withdrawal issue back in Dec and opened a support ticket in which I got the run around until they finally officially announced what the problem was. As the moment, I don't have any $$ in Mtgox but around 180 BTC. My stomach has been in knots all week :-(
Hello,
at the time that the withdrawal stopped I have over $3MM in fiat at Gox. I now have ~5,400 BTC there. It maybe sizeable enough for your attorneys to consider taking on a BTC claim? In any case, if they think that I can sue based on my fiat balance prior to withdrawal suspension, based on the idea that any subsequent trading was essentially fraudulent, well then I would be interested in join the effort.
Hi,
My name is xxxxxx and I am from California (if that matters). I have about 650 BTC in Gox. I haven't slept in days and haven't been able to tell my wife how much I've lost. I was an early adopter, just mining in my basement, and I can't imagine all of my time and work vanishing like this. Please contact me with what I need to do
I am a French citizen. I would like to know how to try and join you in reclaiming my lost funds. I had almost 100.000 EUR in my account. It will be a complete disaster for me if it is stolen.
I cannot reasonably afford to lose the funds I have at Mtgox. I currently hold the majority in USD, but also significant amounts of EUR and BTC.
I would like to join your action lawsui as co-paintiff. I try to keep this short since you are probably getting tons of PMs.
I'm resident of Germany and I'm waiting for ~5700 Euros (~7800 US$) to be withdrawn by MTGOX. I also have about 9 BTCs on my account there. I successfully received a MTGOX-withdrawal of 990 EUR on 2013/12/30, which was ordered on 2013/12/03.
I'm a student and this is almost all of my money I have left (I actually have a lot of debt, which I intended to pay back with that money). I'm really panicking right now and not sure what to do!!!
I'm in Tokyo as well and I lost ~8 BTC and 500,000 in JPY. Please let me know how your case progresses and whether at any time you think it would be possible to get others involved. I really hope I can get at least some of that money back. I need it.
I am very interested in your proposal of suing Mt.Gox to get what is ours.
I would need to sue for more than 70000EUR or over 90000USD. The ammount depends of the bitcoin price - not the manipulated Mt.Gox price, but like the Bitcoin price index on coinbase.com. Although it would be best if Mt.Gox let me simply withdraw my more than 170BTC.
So many people are angry about Mt.Gox and me too. They act like scamers.
I have CSV's, screenshots + multiple records everything for owning 994.90514041 BTC through my mtgox accounts.
Hi, I had 100BTC but a friend had $14000 USD on Gox. Can you put me into contact with whomever is organising the class action lawsuit?
I had some 125BTC & $1000 on MtGox. I'd prefer to recover the BTC but if not possible, USD is better than nothing. Technically at the last price the total is well above the $10000 limit. Can you count me in? What should I do next?
Hey, I'd like to get involved in this as well. Gox has yet to deliver a withdrawal of funds from late last year and currently has all my coins locked up because of their withdrawal lock. Email is below, let me know if you need any other info. Thanks,
(originally I tried to withdraw $30,000.00, but Mt.Gox cancelled my withdraw and asked me to change to GBP. Funds never arrived Mt.Gox confirmed they were unable to wire funds, but funds are not re-instated to my account. Mt.Gox admits in the e-mail funds are mine.)
I'm interested in joining as a co-P in Japan, I have $200k+ in cash balance (no bitcoins) locked up on their site right now. Let me know how many other co-Ps will be represented and the estimated legal costs. Do we have an update on the status of Mt Gox? They haven't filed for bankruptcy just yet. I'm a verified member so I'm thinking they might resume operations and just send us a check, but I'm interested in others' opinions on that.
I found your post just today after the Gox closed the site. I had 10,200 USD with them, which I traded just last week for gox coin. I initially deposited USD from bank account on November 2013, and traded on Gox just about 2 weeks ago, not knowing there was a trouble to withdraw any BTC from them. I do have screen shots from last week from trading and all my history since November 2013. My initial deposits in November have been 8000 USD and 2200 USD, so whatever trading I did in last weeks was for vain since gox did not let any BTC out of the site. Current standing on my account is about 27 BTC and around 2200 USD but since gox coin was never a real BTC, as I just learnt recently, I consider Gox owing me 10200 USD which I initially deposited.
I wish to be include in the class action lawsuit, I an non-us (EU) and have lost 50 BTC and 24,600€.
I have 93BTC at stake in mtgox. Money used to acquire it was 29k EUR.
I would like to join the lawsuit if there is any chance of getting the either the BTC or EURO-equivalent at the price determined at the time of judgement.
I want to participate. I have 85 BTC on Mt Gox.
Please update me and let me know, which further steps I have to take to participate.
I had $28500 in, and purchased 50btc @ $570. So now I have the 49.7btc still in and no fiat. Have been waiting for withdrawal to resume to clean myself of gox forever.
I was very lucky, having pulled out the bulk of my btc holdings from gox in mid-January.
Please respond if whether I can or can't participate.
i too am a Gox victim. I have 69 BTC stuck on Gox. At this stage i would be very reluctant to take such a haircut and convert to USD.
Has the lawyer you hired totally ruled out BTC cases? Is he even taking on new cases?
I have roughly $100K in my account, so it might be worth it for the lawyer to squeeze me in.
I have 50BTC in MTGOX and would be interested in joining. If yes, how large would the fees be?
If Mtgox is indeed gone and finished, I would like to know what the status of this suit is and who I can contact regarding it. I had about 111.777 BTC on gox.
I have 158 btc on MtGox and would like to take part to your lawsuit.
Most of our savings were in bitcoin, and at market rates on other exchanges, I had over $40,000 while my friends had $300,000 to 400,000.
I have 154 BTC and 0 USD in MTGOX.
I live in Malta but would like to know what my options are for joining your case?
I'm a very credible trader who pays his American taxes yearly. I feel so stupid for holding the majority of my BTC exposure on mt gox in hindsight......
I have 301 BTC on mt gox and under $10 USD, my account on gox was a verified account as well.
submitted by cardevitoraphicticia to BitcoinMarkets [link] [comments]

Things you should look for in a cryptocurrency exchange

“Let’s say you want to buy 1 Bitcoin, sign up on an exchange and wait for 3 days. A few days later you receive an e-mail saying ‘Our servers compromised… all funds stolen. We are sorry’. Now where to go? ,"
Recent volatility in cryptocurrency space has created a new customer base looking for profit and quick money, these customers are new investors or rookies can take part due to the open nature of cryptocurrency. It is important to choose with which exchange you are buying and selling cryptocurrency.
Many major exchanges have faced various potential threats in the past such as hacking, regulatory issues, bad business practices due to messy combination of poor management, neglect, and raw inexperience.
Attacks
Number of exchanges attacked and many million of dollars stolen, MtGox was the first one where a group of hackers compromised the servers due to the central nature of the service provider. It is easy to gain access and take control of private keys which controls your bitcoin, so you should always keep your private keys in your control. There are multiple ways to do that, such as hardware wallets, or keeping it in your laptop, mobile phone, etc.
Liquidity
Another problem with many exchanges are lack of liquidity, which means when one wants to withdraw a big chunk of bitcoin, for example,1000 BTC at current price is about $17 Million, exchanges don’t have that much cash available and ready to move, and therefore the entire BTC market can fluctuate in seconds.
Accessibility
There is no such thing as an instant in these exchanges as you have to first verify (KYC and AML) your account which can take 10 minutes to 3 days depending on your region. Only after such long waiting you can transfer real cash from your bank account, but that is also unlikely, because many local banks are not supporting these kinds of exchanges. The solution to this problem is to buy using an escrow mechanism and get crypto in the same region where one pays using local currency in the same region, such service provider being known as LocalBitcoins.
Support
Another approach to the above mentioned problem is to reduce the cost of switch for traders, so the users can convert token to token without leaving the wallet. It is only in decentralized exchanges which lacks support for a commodity, ease of use and overall lacks user support.
Due to financial transaction exchanges were always under scrutiny, Bittrex came under radar for an incident in which a handful of user documents merged into one support ticket and released in a public forum.
Once again, there is no support when you do not understand something of the website of the exchange or you need to know certain things about the fees. So, you will have to create the support ticket yourself and wait for the answer an hour depending on the volume of tickets. The support system of exchanges is dingy and the company like ‘Coinbase’ does not even have a live chat or a phone number where one can call and get help.
Manipulation
Cryptocurrencies are speculative and bound to manipulation - there have been many incidents on these central exchanges where “Spoofing” is seen. With ‘spoofing’, one puts large buy or sell orders driving traders in one direction and then cancels the order before execution. This implies that anyone who can gain access to trading with large amount of BTC can drive prices to go crazy.
As a precaution many exchanges are locking down a number of accounts if any suspicious activity seen, resulting in distress within the community and customers. Similar incidents reported by community, where whenever ‘Tether’ currency denomination released on Blockchain, there was a sudden surge in the value of the Bitcoin. ‘Tether’ is a cryptocurrency which backed by $1 and it is one of the subsidiary of ‘Bitfinex’. ‘Bitfinex’ banking relationship jeopardized due to a DDOS hack. This gives rise to the question: is Tether a cryptocurrency or just a scam. Newcomers to Blockchain may notice the irony — in an industry obsessed with decentralization, some of the biggest exchanges are centralized, trusted institutions.
Future
“Decentralized exchanges are the way of the future,” said Hugh Madden, technical director for ‘openANX’, a decentralized exchange infrastructure protocol. With the new model in decentralised exchanges you have no order book — buy and sell orders are matched peer-to-peer. There is no central authority where hackers can attack and drain money.
Exchanges have to address these problems in future:
  1. Accessible - faster KYC process , international banking support and integration.
  2. End-to-End Security – Exchanges need to scale , better security for customers to their own data centers.
  3. Cold Storage – Storing all bitcoins, cryptocurrency in cold storage reduces the risk of hacking coins.
  4. Technology Architecture – Right now the exchange architecture is straightforward and the insecure REST API exposed to the world. Using service such as Apache Kafka can reduce I/O throughput.
  5. Banking – The banks do not understand cryptocurrency, if the exchanges want to stay, they have to work together with the bank to provide full transparency within the system .
  6. Liquidity – Right now every exchange lacks liquidity,one of the solution to this problem could be the introducing of new services - for example, the user can spend coins from the exchange for some service or asset.
  7. Easy – It is easy to use.
These protocols are still in development phase, but as we continue to see the threats on centralised exchanges, it is imminent that decentralised exchanges will take over. The answer lies in technology development and complete use of tokens.
In conclusion, as a crypto user one has to be very careful what exchanges they are dealing with and make sure the exchange has a valid banking setup or relationship, verification process and resolution mechanism and meets all the terms and conditions; make sure also, that in case of hack or solvency, you will get your money back or at least a part of it .
Do your own research before engaging in the cryptocurrency space.
submitted by tradxwrite to CryptoCurrencies [link] [comments]

post by a Chinese citizen on how the China rally started and how it's likely to be in the future (dated October 2013)

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=315380.0;all
reposted from thread dated 10/21/13, price was $190 on mtgox :
"These reports suggests that the adoption by Baidu is a signal that the big vendors are accepting bitccoin - consider the close tie between baidu and central government, that the government may be interested too. It is like saying Microsoft or Facebook started to accept bitcoin. That tapped on the emotion and BTC rose.
I think the big vendors are no way closer to accepting bitcoin in the last week than any weeks before. It is indeed a small change, and signals nothing from big vendors nor the central government at all.
Chinese information technology vendors, including the big ones, in general prefer the studio model. A big company is devided into multiple studios, some companys have 100 studios. They each compete against each other. They compete on revenue and profit, within the embralla of a same company. Each studio find their own ways of making profit, and enjoy freedom of decision as long as they are making money. The mother company acts like a referee, dismissing unprofitable studios and buying out (admitting) small competitors to form new studios; the mother company also act as a protector, backing the studios with tremendous PR and governmental relationship power in case their competitor choose to fight on a different level (which also happens). This fast-proliferating fast-evoluting style isn't very co-ordinated, but it is effective because in general in China our culture emphasize competition, and we like to compete and win and we work the best if competition is physically next door. If instead big vendors are organized like Microsoft to co-operate and create huge products (Windows 7) in 5-year span, the youngsters wouldn't stay on their edge - they need quick confirmation whether they are wining or not - they work very hard but doesn't have much patience. Skipping between studios is frequent, the fast-growing studios get more resource and people.
The recent acceptance of bitcoin is likely a decision of a single stuidio in the embralla of baidu, perhaps trying to beat other studios of the same company. Baidu HQs speaksman said nothing about bitcoin in the whole year. How Baidu HQs treats the move is unkown, and they probably don't have an attitude, for it (bitcoin) is trivial compare to the huge online information market they are already on. News interview suggests this is a decision of an individual studio: "We always try to satisfy the webmasters, so when they want to pay with bitcoin, we accept them". Notice the interviewee said 'webmasters', that's the customers of this studio, not Baidu in whole, and he speaks for his own studio.
Also take notice the customer of this studio (jiasule.baidu.com), the webmasters, happen to be the major group of bitcoin miners in China.
So why such a small piece of news that indicates nothing for sure, stirs up such a rally? More important than the news itself it says Chinese investors are desperately looking for a reason to rally. They perhaps expected bitcoin to be above 1000¥ for a long time, now they only need a slight upward vibrate to rally. And they have a good reason to hope for a rally, for they bought huge amount of mining equipments in anticipation of raise of bitcoin value.
My reading of the event is, that Chinese investors are anticipating a rally for a long time, thus it won't cool down in just a few days. However they are speculating, not having much faith in sustanibility of bitcoin and may be frighten away by small bad news within China. They are less sensitive to western news like silkroad.
In China we have highly centralized political power. The chance Chinese government allows bitcoin on the markets (when it calls their attention) is like the chance U.S. government raise debt in BTC. The big vendors foresee it and shouldn't be interested. Besides we have a monoplay business atomosphere in China (every player are greedy, wants to win and take all), and you don't monoplay bitcoin. I see no reason Baidu being interested to include bitcoin into their development strategy. Small vendors are much more likely to be interested in btc.
(OP is a Chinese citizen in Beijing)" .
If Chinese government pays attention to bitcoin, it would act the same way they do towards shadow banking: fine those involved in bitcoin yet backed by government, and prosecute the entities without gvernment backing (even execute a few, like the unlucky millionaire Wu Ying last year and Zeng Chengjie this year). The charge will be as usual: illegal fund-raising.
Right now there are two points that needs to be considered on understaind Chinese behaviour:
  1. Chinese traders speculate. Few believed in a non-governmental currency taking root, as few believed anything significant yet non-governmental can take root. This translate to a huge bear market when Chinese government acts.
  2. The atomsphere in China is like the roaring twenties which I read from books. Everyone feels like they are ready to make a big fortune. This can translates to potential huge bulls.
My two cents.
. .
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=315380.msg3377991#msg3377991
So it is not the question whether bitcoin can be regulated, but whether bitcoin can obey. Bitcoin trading can be regulated but bitcoin itself bends to no one - which begets the question whether or not it will be allowed to live.
On the other hand, if Bitcoin becomes so significant that the government has to make a decision, and they decided to let it live, the acceptance of bitcoin will have no consumer psychological barrier, because, as you said, we are pretty familiar with virtual currencies.
. .
My personal opinion is that China is in not going to have a robust bitcoin economy anywhere in the medium or long term future.
  1. China currently has a $50k USD restrictions on the amount of money its citizens can take out of the country. Bitcoin with its anonymous nature can easily by pass these restrictions. yeah i know there's AML/ KYC rules set up for BTCchina now but i know that if btc becomes a widely circulated "commodity" in exchange for services and goods that it will be easier to launder and hide illicit gains in bitcoin than it would be to hide them yuan. http://www.china-briefing.com/news/2011/11/11/getting-cash-money-rmb-out-of-china.html
  2. if citizens in China start using btc as a "commodity" in exchange for services and goods that would threaten the stability of the chinese yuan. it certainly would not raise the value of the yuan. i don't see how the chinese govt would encourage this to happen.
  3. the Chinese banks are banned from offering services/goods in bitcoin. that was NOT a good sign. it certainly wont make it easier to start bitcoin related businesses in china. Baidu/China Telecom's immediate removal of btc as a payment option following the offical govt announcement was NOT a good sign. i don't know how anybody can spin those actions as a positive for bitcoin.
  4. i also don't believe that bitcoin is booming in China because it's citizens believe in it as an alternative currency. I believe the price skyrocketed due to greed and pure speculation. take a look at the 2010 China Garlic Bubble where in a few months the price of garlic rose 40-50x due to pure speculation, price manipulation and hoarding. Sound familiar to bitcoin in China? http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=121125739
  5. Plenty of redditors have claimed that China would be supportive of btc because it would devalue the US dollar and raise it's own yuan in value for foreign trade. that's highly unlikely since the Yuan is already the #2 most used currency for foreign trade in the world. China is about to start direct trade with the UK in yuan/pounds. the daily global trade in Chinese Yuan is over $120 billion which is 10x the market cap of bitcoin. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-12-03/yuan-passes-euro-to-be-second-most-used-trade-finance-currency.html
  6. China is a quasi-totalitarian regime that has no qualms about crushing any form of rebellion (labour camps for journalists, tiananmen square, human rights violations, highest # of executions in the world). Bitcoin by its very nature is designed to give the power back to its people, its users. China's entire recent history is about controlling it's people.
tldr: bitcoin gives freedom and power to the Chinese citizens, the chinese government is realizes this and will move to prevent China from ever having a robust btc economy where btc will be widely traded for services/goods. Chinese citizens have a history of participating in mass speculative bubbles without caring about the fundamental value.
(i could be wrong about the future of bitcoin in China but based on China's history i unfortunately might be right. also if any college students are reading this, please don't take out student loans to buy bitcoins, it is a huge speculative bubble in China and if the chinese govt comes down, you will see the bitcoin economy cut in half or more.)
submitted by yomofos to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Introduction into futures trading: how to profit from increasing price without buying more Bitcoins

It is widely known that derivatives (such as futures and options) and leveraged trading can be very risky, as it is possible to lose all the money by losing in a "bet".
However, derivatives can also be used to hedge one's risks, shaping them in the way he wants.
Let's consider an example. Suppose you already have 100 BTC. So you get $100 USD of profit each time BTC/USD exchange rate goes up by $1.
That's great, but you want more, suppose you believe that exchange rate continues to rise, so you want to double your profits.
One way to do that is to buy 100 BTC more, but you need $8000 USD to do that. Not everybody has that much money sitting in bank account, ready to be transfered.
Another problem is what it does to risk. If you double your long position, you double both profit and loss. Exchange rate droping by $1 means $200 USD loss for you.
And maximum possible loss goes from $8000 USD to $16000 USD... Let's be honest, risk exists. For example, government might close or isolate MtGox, or perform 51% attack. (It currently costs $5M USD to buy 60 Th/s worth of ASIC miners from Avalon... It is a pocket money for government.) Perhaps exchange rate won't fall down to 0, 90% loss is never a good thing. ($14400 USD in this example...)
So let's go back to futures... What if I tell you that you can increase your possible profits without increasing maximum loss? It is possible.
I'm more familiar with futures trading, so I will use them in this example. I'll try to cover options once I do more research.
Disclaimer: I'm not in any way affiliated with services I mention, I have no idea whether they are secure, aside from the fact that they haven't yet run away with money. Use at your own risk. If they run away with your money, that's not my fault.
So here's what you can do:
  1. Move 30 BTC into icbit.se account.
  2. Buy 800 of BTC/USD contracts (each contract is $10 USD, so 800 contracts is $8000 USD worth of Bitcoins).
  3. Now your profit&loss is same as if you bought $8000 USD worth of Bitcoin on market.
  4. You can take profit/loss at any time by buying 800 contracts, or you can wait until settlement.
Your maximum possible loss is still $8000 USD because you haven't put any more US dollars into it. But your potential profit is same as if you put $8000 USD... Cool, isn't it?
Well, there's no such thing as a free lunch, so there are caveats and downsides, of course.
First thing is that in case with futures, you aren't buying at current MtGox price, you're buying at futures price, which is subject to supply and demand on its own. Currently BTC/USD-04.13 futures trade in 95...100 range, which is quite above $89 on mtgox. This happens because there is higher demand on ICBIT, and people aren't willing to arbitrage.
If you buy at $95 you will get profit only if price goes above $95. (In case with BTC/USD-04.13 settlement happens on 2013-04-14, so you take profit if average mtgox price is above $95 on that day. But you can sell any time before settlement.) If it is lower than $95 you have a loss. Also, don't forget about trading fees, they are 0.003 BTC per 1 contract for this specific contract.
This sounds like a bummer, but note that there are contracts which settle in June and September. They might offer more reasonable futures prices.
Another thing to note is daily clearing. Clearing price is calculated every day at 20:00 UTC, amount equivalent to profit&loss is added or subtracted to your Bitcoin balance, and execution price is reset to clearing price. Some people freak out when they see it, but that's just how it works. In the end, your overall profit & loss is same no matter how many clearings there were...
Except one thing: forced liquidation. If your loss isn't covered by your Bitcoin balance, exchange will try to liquidate you position, possibly at unfavorable price... And you might end up in debt to exchange.
But do not worry, they do not know where you live :) , so maximum loss on futures is limited by the amount you deposited. Say, if you deposited 30 BTC you cannot really lose more than 30 BTC. But futures price might go down and then bounce back, so this is still an additional risk. (Note that you can save your position by depositing more bitcoins, but that increases your maximum potential loss...)
If some traders will end up in debt, exchange will cap profit of other traders... That sucks, but likely missing profits won't be significant. Also, you're guaranteed to have at least some profit.
And, of course, there is a risk of outright fraud and theft... Having bitcoins on exchange's balance is not same thing as having them in your wallet. But still, your loss is limited.
Now let's talk about taking short position... Of course, it is possible with futures trading: just sell contracts you don't have. They work in a same way, but there is an interesting opportunity:
when futures price is above spot price (say, on MtGox), you can arbitrage, i.e. earn money without taking a risk. (EDIT: Not completely without risk, you're exposed to daily price fluctuations on MtGox because ICBIT settles in Bitcoin and you need to move money to MtGox to close position completely.)
(I'm talking only about trading risk, you're still exposed to counter-party risks.)
For example, suppose you start with having $8000 USD on mtgox. You buy 100 BTC @80 and move 30 BTC to ICBIT account, then sell 1000 BTC/USD contracts @100. After settlement, you move bitcoins back to Mtgox and sell them... And you're guaranteed very likely to earn certain profit in US dollars, no matter what Bitcoin price is.
Here's a detailed description of arbitrage from exchange operator: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=131622.0
Now, while we are here, I've been advocating secure derivative trading based on "blockchain escrow" (multi-sig, to be specific) which would not allow an exchange to run away with money. I've even been trying to build it myself for some time, but haven't got anywhere yet. I mention this just so you people understand that I'm not a shill for ICBIT.
Derivative trading might be fun, I recommend starting with some small amount. Say, 0.1 BTC is enough start on ICBIT. Consider putting more into it only when you're comfortable.
submitted by killerstorm to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Cocaine and Hookers: Flushing out the bad money - Reasons for the boom, and why the Drop is good for Bitcoin

It's been a turbulent ride these last few weeks, we've seen prices reach a peak of $266, and problems at MtGox crash a market that was sure to rise and rise were it not for technical constraints.
I personally expected us to see it plateau at around $100, but as I write this we are seeing bitcoin drop to its lowest point in awhile - $56. Today is Tuedsay, which means most BTC holders with accounts at MtGox would have gotten online during work hours yesterday. We all expected a rise. So why the drop?
To answer this question, first I urge you to do some background reading.
British Traders Have Discovered BitCoin - BusinessInsider
The business insider article above, printed last April, cites that up to 90% of London traders were actively involved in the bitcoin market "looking for a quick 2000%". This means that accounts associated with Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs in London and New York had amassed a great deal of bitcoin wealth (buying in as they did at around $4.88).
The Telegraph Article "Financial crisis caused by too many bankers taking cocaine, says former drugs tsar" recently published in the Telegraph offers us a rare insight into what has gone so wrong in the world of finance.
Crisis Caused By Bankers Taking Too Much Cocaine Says Former UK Drugs Tsar - The Telegraph
David Nutt, the former UK Government drugs tsar, who was sacked after claiming that horse riding was as safe as taking ecstasy (lulz) said that too many bankers who took the drug were “overconfident” and so “took more risks” and said that not only did it lead to the current crisis in this country, but also the 1995 collapse of Barings bank.
He said cocaine was perfect for their "culture of excitement and drive and more and more and more", adding: “Bankers use cocaine and got us into this terrible mess. It is a 'more' drug."
So, let's rewind 12 months…At the time there were very few 'legit' online places to spend bitcoin: the Silk Road and Satoshi Circle were about the only place these traders could spend their accumulated BTC wealth. This was a marriage made in heaven - not only did bitcoin give these greedy traders the means to make 'quick 2000%'s' at the expense of those die-hard bitcoin supporters in it for the long haul, but it also provided a means for them to fuel their lavish excesses via the Silk Road, offering, as it does, a safer and cheaper alternative to buying street drugs.
You can imagine them corralled around a computer, fuelled by the white stuff, powered by arrogance and greed, thinking their experience in the Stock Markets of the world would be enough to easily outsmart the neck beards that had had the audacity to enter 'their' world with the revolutionary concept we call decentralised currency. They would have course have had little regard for the beauty of the system that Satoshi invented, or it's utility for ending the senseless debasement of the lives ordinary folk, that has resulted from their mess. Hedonists seeking only highs from hookers and coke very rarely stop to look around at the problems in the world and wonder whether it could be fixed.
Certainly, the majority of those traders wouldn't have perceived bitcoin as an existential threat to their way of life, and yet that is exactly what it represents. Rest assured that you can be certain that after all the media coverage of the last few weeks, if they didm't know before, they definitely know now just what a threat bitcoin poses. The wealth they have accumulated through excess and greed is under the hammer, their jobs and lifestyles are on borrowed time, and that's why we will see the price continue to drop, as they cash out - taking losses as they do - as those we lovingly refer to as The Spartans hold strong, refusing to move (for they have already won). And so, as the weak hands leave the bitcoin market one by one, they will be heading to the lifeboats on what they must surely know is a sinking ship…
These are the final death throes of a dying, corrupt and hyptocritcal regime.
Be certain their 'bail out' will not affect the long term stability of bitcoin. On the contrary, this will only strengthen us going forward, separating the wheat from the chaff so to speak.
I wish these people the best, we are all entitled to make mistakes. Life is about learning from them and being humble enough to say "I was wrong" when you know you were. Talking of which, I believe we all owe a debt of gratitude to MtGox for the flack we threw at them during this insane period, for had the market not crashed, we may very well see prices in the $1000s right now, fuelled by those people looking to make a "quick 2000%" at the expense of others.
For those traders of the "Don't be evil" persuasion who will soon be looking for a new job, may I point you to : http://www.coinsetter.com/ who are moving quickly in setting up a forex trading platform where your skills will be a good fit. As for the rest, I would recommend an extended stint in rehab.
submitted by smeggletoot to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Emma's Dark Mark Karpeles letter

Nice blogpost I liked from the look of a normal real person and how mtgox fallout has caused real distress to real people.
http://emnode.blogspot.com/2014/02/dear-mark-karpeles-my-name-is-emma.html
An Open Letter to Mark Karpeles Dear Mark Karpeles,
My name is Emma. At the bottom of this letter you will find an address but I want you to know me first. We have never really spoken tho we have been in the same channels on IRC. I'm going to ask others to help me get this letter to you because I want you to know how the choices you made have affected a regular person.
Unlike yourself I am not wealthy or very technically inclined. I like to learn and I love being around smart people - that's how I ended up on Freenode. When my close friends started talking about bitcoins I got some along with them. That was years ago and most of them sold their coins long ago. But I held mine. I held them because I could see what great potential they had for me and for everyone else. My job involves service to others. I'm not highly paid and real investing is beyond my reach. The moment I discovered bitcoins I knew there was a chance to change my life.
With the little that I make, I scrounged and saved, and bought some bitcoins on MtGox every week. This was back in 2011 and fewer people knew about them then. I did this for as long as I could until the day they finally became too expensive and I had to stop. I was never a trader. And I never sold. I just waited. And waited. Because I believed in what bitcoins could do, and what they could be. In the end I had 120 bitcoins that I knew would be worth something one day.
The 120 coins you lost were more valuable than all the money I have ever saved, or may ever save again. But while that loss is staggering it is not what breaks my heart; my heart is broken when I realize it is more than just my 120 BTC that's gone. It's the opportunity that can never be brought back. Three years ago, coins were for people who could dream. Today coins are for people who have money, and that does not include me.
When I saw that coins were nearing $800 dollars I came back to Mtgox to exchange them for enough money to pay off all my debts. It was money I could go to school with and be debt free. It was money I could use to make more traditional investments - something very difficult for people who live on a paycheck such as I do.
But when I came back to Mtgox I found that more than just the price of coins had changed. I would need to be verified and was told that would take 10 days. Then 20 days. Then an indefinite number of days. Then I found out that Mtgox was not good at letting people in the USA get their dollars anymore. I tried to get out what I owned for months and months. I was told by Mtgox employees I should wait. And I had waited three years so why not wait some more. I waited Mark, I waited through it all until you cut off our ability to withdraw anything at all. And now it's gone.
I know you are probably hurting too. I know you probably never wanted to hurt people like me. But you need to know that you have. I don't know what the future holds but I don't go to work anymore dreaming about what 120 BTC could do. You needn't worry about me suing you since I can't afford to do that either.
I don't know how many coins Mtgox still has but I think you must have some coins left in your personal wallet. For you maybe 120 coins is not that much, or maybe it is now. I don't know. Here is what I know -- I know there is some risk in owning bitcoins, but that risk was supposed to be from governments or being new, the risk was not supposed to be from insufficiently distrusting your ability. The risk was not supposed to be from believing that an exchange endorsed by the Bitcoin Foundation was not an exchange at all.
So I'm going to ask you to repair me from your personal wallet. If you lost most of your coins on MtGox as well then please just send me whatever fits within the number of coins and honor you have left.
If you wish to speak with me you can find me on Freenode. Just query emma. I will verify that this is really me. If you send me more than 120 BTC I will donate the excess to the EFF.
May history be kind to you, -- Emma (former bitcoin owner, former bitcoin enthusiast)
http://emnode.blogspot.com/2014/02/dear-mark-karpeles-my-name-is-emma.html
edit: remove BTC address
submitted by myrond42 to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Bitcoin Alert App for iOS

Our team have developed an app that allows investors and traders to receive live alerts on their phones when the condition is met.
Currently the general conditions are: Last Price Last Volume 24 Hour Volume
Currently supported security exchanges are: Havelock Investments BTCT.Co (Down) MtGox MCXNOW BTC-E Bitstamp
Other exchanges that have API will be added soon. Let us know which additional exchanges you would like to use.
https://itunes.apple.com/app/bitcoin-alert/id699408229
1.2 update soon.. Exchanges able to use 796.com, cryptostocks.com
submitted by jjangg96 to BitcoinStocks [link] [comments]

72-hour Peercoin Press Rush Discussion Thread

Hello,
The official peercointalk 72 hour Press Rush threads can be found here, and while you can discuss things there, if you want to discuss them here(on reddit) you can do it in this thread.(note; that's not to say stop posting links, just if you want a common thread for discussion here you go)
I'll just post some of the instructions given there(as of 9pm UTC)
Action:
  1. Make a comment under each article A. example; article "Bitcoin is soaring in price" -> "It's nice to see the public finally starting to learn about top cryptos such as Bitcoin and Peercoin (PPC) B. Not sure what else to include? Talk about Trekcon, talk about our active community, talk about Peercoin being energy efficient..
  2. Keep track of the user accounts you created for each article (makes it easier next time)
Links
Peercoin Facebook Group
Wired
ArsTechnica article
ABC News article
Forbes article
Business Insider
MTGox Exchange (request support of Peercoin (PPC) on their exchange)
Star Trek subreddit post regarding peercoin
Forbes
Live Twitter Mentions of Peercoin (please tweet where mentioned)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=326216.0
https://cryptocointalk.com/topic/1501-ppc-press-release-peercoin-is-the-official-crypto-for-trek-con-springfield/
submitted by Bagog- to peercoin [link] [comments]

Exchange report: bitfinex - 4.5 star

Heard user byronbb talk and Cylta from irc speak about bitfinex and decided to try it out. I believe part of the reason the prices have wildly shot up lately is due to the lack of a good options or margin trading market. Bitfinex aims to solve the latter at least.
Features:
"Regular" exchange - buy and sell bitcoins for USD. The entire exchange works off of MtGox, so there is always liquidity. There is an internal exchange that offers extremely low fees (0.1%) if traded internally. Even if you end up trading on MtGox, you'll only pay 0.4%, which beats the low volume price of 0.6% from MtGox. Funding options are limited, but I like the idea. I only tried using the MtGox codes funding options, which is actually superior. It is instant and you get to keep your money at MtGox for security.
Margin Trading - Up to 5x leverage. Since prices have been going up non-stop, I decided a correction was in order at $47. It kept going up to z$49 after I shorted a large amount, but I decided to short more at $49. The low interest rates provided by other users made that easy. I ended up making a healthy chunk of coins when it dropped to around $43-44.
Lending - All lending is peer-to-peer. When I first got in, the rates were very reasonable (as low as 5.5% APR) and there was nearly 1k coins offered to be loaned. It is a great way for someone to me safely making interest on their bitcoins, and gives opportunity to others like myself, to take risks and make big bets. (If you look now, the rates are much higher, probably because of me, but that's an opportunity for you to offer lower rates and make a great return on your bitcoins).
Basically, in terms of features, I'd say Bitfinex only lacks an options market. Otherwise, it is doing exactly the things I'd imagine an up and coming exchange would do to challange MtGox. Although Bitfinex is basically leeching off of MtGox right now, it has the potential to be a solid second place soon, especially since the fee's would attract many professional traders.
The only bad things about it now is the UI/UX, which is extremely confusing for a first time user. I recommend playing with small amounts of money first, and seeing how everything works.
Final Thoughts:
Volume for the last 24 hours is 11632.23 BTC, officially making it the 2nd largest USD market, only 1 month afte its release. The site is definitely well thought out, and well executed. We will soon live in a world not dominated by 1 exchange. There's also the additional benefit of located off-shore, in Hong-Kong, for those who might be concerned about the Coinlab move.
I'm not sure how Bitfinex execute orders on MtGox fairly quickly and discretely. When I submit the order, I never see it show up on the MtGox depth chart, but even with all the lag today, orders didn't seem like they took longer than they would have at MtGox. If anyone knows how they do this, please elaborate.
I highly encourage you to give Bitfinex a try. It's going to be worth it. And if this review was helpful to you, or made you money, than consider making a donation to: 1wUAhcgT2CgGhsG2zeYeqi2TYx1Efuqb7
Cheers.
submitted by sirkent to Bitcoin [link] [comments]

Final update on that class action suit opened against Gox

Source: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=476535.msg5255853
FINAL UPDATE
I'm sure that everyone is aware that MtGox declared bankruptcy yesterday. As such, our lawsuit is off and we, like everyone, will be filing a claim in bankruptcy court. Words cannot express my (our) disappointment in this whole debacle. Over the last week I have spoken to people from all around the world, many of whom are now facing financial catastrophe - and it is heartbreaking. It is especially disheartening given the noble endeavor we had set out to achieve. To create a financial system based on open source principals that would level the playing field for people around the world and liberate them from the various corrupt central banks sabotaging their success and financial freedom. Yet here we are, betrayed by a trust system similar to what we sought to avoid. Ultimately, I still believe in cryptocurrency technology and how it will revolutionize the financial world; but it is clear that still has a lot of growing up to do - both the protocol and the service ecosystem. As a testament to the REAL PEOPLE who've been left in the wake of this lesson, I'd like to share with you a small sample of the personal messages I received (personal information removed).
Hello,
I am in Japan and have deposited 12.499 million Yen (about USD 122,000) at MtGox from October to December 2013. I currently have 175 BTCs and 13,000 Yen in cash at their exchange. I also have a Premium status account.
Please let me know how to proceed. That was most of my retirement money.
Hi.
My name is xxx and I live in Sweden, Malmö. I am writing for me and for my girlfriend and my dad. We all bought and sold bitcoins a last years and made some money. We have taken out some money when we need to and right now me and my girlfriend was going to buy a house and start a family so we tried to withdraw the money in January. Since the money didn't show up after 4 weeks I tried to contact them but still nothing. I hope that together with you and some others get at least some money back. If you need any proof of the withdrawals or such I can provide some of it. We had in total $49000 on the accounts.
we are unsure how to proceed.
Help!
I have about 90 BTC and no USD in my mtgox account, which I would very much like to receive back at some point. It's only just sinking in that it might all be gone.. I can't believe I waited so long before getting it out somewhere safe, but.. here we are.
Hey there, I am interested in being a plaintiff as well. I had about 70k in Mtgox in Dec due to the price explosion in November and attempted to withdraw some funds since I wasn't comfortable having that amount hosted there. I ran into the withdrawal issue back in Dec and opened a support ticket in which I got the run around until they finally officially announced what the problem was. As the moment, I don't have any $$ in Mtgox but around 180 BTC. My stomach has been in knots all week :-(
Hello,
at the time that the withdrawal stopped I have over $3MM in fiat at Gox. I now have ~5,400 BTC there. It maybe sizeable enough for your attorneys to consider taking on a BTC claim? In any case, if they think that I can sue based on my fiat balance prior to withdrawal suspension, based on the idea that any subsequent trading was essentially fraudulent, well then I would be interested in join the effort.
Hi,
My name is xxxxxx and I am from California (if that matters). I have about 650 BTC in Gox. I haven't slept in days and haven't been able to tell my wife how much I've lost. I was an early adopter, just mining in my basement, and I can't imagine all of my time and work vanishing like this. Please contact me with what I need to do
I am a French citizen. I would like to know how to try and join you in reclaiming my lost funds. I had almost 100.000 EUR in my account. It will be a complete disaster for me if it is stolen.
I cannot reasonably afford to lose the funds I have at Mtgox. I currently hold the majority in USD, but also significant amounts of EUR and BTC.
I would like to join your action lawsui as co-paintiff. I try to keep this short since you are probably getting tons of PMs.
I'm resident of Germany and I'm waiting for ~5700 Euros (~7800 US$) to be withdrawn by MTGOX. I also have about 9 BTCs on my account there. I successfully received a MTGOX-withdrawal of 990 EUR on 2013/12/30, which was ordered on 2013/12/03.
I'm a student and this is almost all of my money I have left (I actually have a lot of debt, which I intended to pay back with that money). I'm really panicking right now and not sure what to do!!!
I'm in Tokyo as well and I lost ~8 BTC and 500,000 in JPY. Please let me know how your case progresses and whether at any time you think it would be possible to get others involved. I really hope I can get at least some of that money back. I need it.
I am very interested in your proposal of suing Mt.Gox to get what is ours.
I would need to sue for more than 70000EUR or over 90000USD. The ammount depends of the bitcoin price - not the manipulated Mt.Gox price, but like the Bitcoin price index on coinbase.com. Although it would be best if Mt.Gox let me simply withdraw my more than 170BTC.
So many people are angry about Mt.Gox and me too. They act like scamers.
I have CSV's, screenshots + multiple records everything for owning 994.90514041 BTC through my mtgox accounts.
Hi, I had 100BTC but a friend had $14000 USD on Gox. Can you put me into contact with whomever is organising the class action lawsuit?
I had some 125BTC & $1000 on MtGox. I'd prefer to recover the BTC but if not possible, USD is better than nothing. Technically at the last price the total is well above the $10000 limit. Can you count me in? What should I do next?
Hey, I'd like to get involved in this as well. Gox has yet to deliver a withdrawal of funds from late last year and currently has all my coins locked up because of their withdrawal lock. Email is below, let me know if you need any other info. Thanks,
(originally I tried to withdraw $30,000.00, but Mt.Gox cancelled my withdraw and asked me to change to GBP. Funds never arrived Mt.Gox confirmed they were unable to wire funds, but funds are not re-instated to my account. Mt.Gox admits in the e-mail funds are mine.)
I'm interested in joining as a co-P in Japan, I have $200k+ in cash balance (no bitcoins) locked up on their site right now. Let me know how many other co-Ps will be represented and the estimated legal costs. Do we have an update on the status of Mt Gox? They haven't filed for bankruptcy just yet. I'm a verified member so I'm thinking they might resume operations and just send us a check, but I'm interested in others' opinions on that.
I found your post just today after the Gox closed the site. I had 10,200 USD with them, which I traded just last week for gox coin. I initially deposited USD from bank account on November 2013, and traded on Gox just about 2 weeks ago, not knowing there was a trouble to withdraw any BTC from them. I do have screen shots from last week from trading and all my history since November 2013. My initial deposits in November have been 8000 USD and 2200 USD, so whatever trading I did in last weeks was for vain since gox did not let any BTC out of the site. Current standing on my account is about 27 BTC and around 2200 USD but since gox coin was never a real BTC, as I just learnt recently, I consider Gox owing me 10200 USD which I initially deposited.
I wish to be include in the class action lawsuit, I an non-us (EU) and have lost 50 BTC and 24,600€.
I have 93BTC at stake in mtgox. Money used to acquire it was 29k EUR.
I would like to join the lawsuit if there is any chance of getting the either the BTC or EURO-equivalent at the price determined at the time of judgement.
I want to participate. I have 85 BTC on Mt Gox.
Please update me and let me know, which further steps I have to take to participate.
I had $28500 in, and purchased 50btc @ $570. So now I have the 49.7btc still in and no fiat. Have been waiting for withdrawal to resume to clean myself of gox forever.
I was very lucky, having pulled out the bulk of my btc holdings from gox in mid-January.
Please respond if whether I can or can't participate.
i too am a Gox victim. I have 69 BTC stuck on Gox. At this stage i would be very reluctant to take such a haircut and convert to USD.
Has the lawyer you hired totally ruled out BTC cases? Is he even taking on new cases?
I have roughly $100K in my account, so it might be worth it for the lawyer to squeeze me in.
I have 50BTC in MTGOX and would be interested in joining. If yes, how large would the fees be?
If Mtgox is indeed gone and finished, I would like to know what the status of this suit is and who I can contact regarding it. I had about 111.777 BTC on gox.
I have 158 btc on MtGox and would like to take part to your lawsuit.
Most of our savings were in bitcoin, and at market rates on other exchanges, I had over $40,000 while my friends had $300,000 to 400,000.
I have 154 BTC and 0 USD in MTGOX.
I live in Malta but would like to know what my options are for joining your case?
I'm a very credible trader who pays his American taxes yearly. I feel so stupid for holding the majority of my BTC exposure on mt gox in hindsight......
I have 301 BTC on mt gox and under $10 USD, my account on gox was a verified account as well.
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Mt. Gox, called "Mount Gox" or simply "Gox", was the most widely used bitcoin currency exchange market from shortly after its inception in 2010 to its insolvency late 2013. The market was closed February 25, 2014 and has since filed for bankruptcy protection in Japan and the United States, after losing 640 thousand bitcoins.. A registrant on Mt. Gox had at least two sub-accounts: one for ... We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. If you continue to use this site we will assume that you are happy with it. Ok No The outcome of our analysis on the Bitcoin Trader platform leads us to support the claims that Bitcoin Trader is 100% legit and can assist new and experienced traders in generating a passive income and growing their wealth. It is estimated that a new user can earn between €200 and €1000 every week. This depends on how much money the user invests and keeps reinvesting. Earning a significant ... Bitcoin is a distributed, worldwide, decentralized digital money … Press J to jump to the feed. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. r/Bitcoin. log in sign up. User account menu. 10. Bitcoin address shortener from - btc.to, by MtGox Live. Close. 10. Posted by. u/realrasengan. 8 years ago. Archived. Bitcoin address shortener from - btc.to, by MtGox Live. forum ... r/Bitcoin: A community dedicated to Bitcoin, the currency of the Internet. Bitcoin is a distributed, worldwide, decentralized digital money …

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Qt Bitcoin Trader - trading client for Mt.Gox and BTC-e ...

At the Tokyo office tower housing Mt.Gox, bitcoin trader Kolin Burgess said he had picketed the building since 14 February after flying in from London, hoping to get back 320,000 US dollars he had ... Thanks for Watching! If you enjoy our videos please like, share or subscribe. Web page http://qtopentrader.com/ Open source trading client for Mt.Gox and BTC-e written in Qt. This software helps you to open and close Mt.Gox orders very... MtGox USD to BTC-e Bitcoins in 1 minute This video shows the transfer of MtGox USD funds via the integrated Bitinstant functions of BTC-Trader to the BTC-e exchange and purchase of Bitcoins on BTC ... MtGox Bitcoins To BTC Bitcoins BITCOIN PRICE , BITCOIN FUTURE in doubt http://youtu.be/eO-yrpQpIT8 What is NAMECOIN BITCOIN'S First Fork http://youtu.be/oBkh...

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